Mac v MS

[Shao Feng-Li]

Why does everyone seem to think Microsoft is evil, and Mac is so great?

[Straylight]

The mac OS is about ten times better than Windows. It is more stable, and it's based on UNIX, so you can do lots of cool stuff with it. Also, it doesn't have all the security issues of Windows.

Having installed Linux on both of my machines I have come to a conclusion -- Windows survives because the majority of popular PC software only works on Microsoft operating systems.

[Shao Feng-Li]

Having installed Linux on both of my machines I have come to a conclusion -- Windows survives because the majority of popular PC software only works on Microsoft operating systems.

hmm bill gates is pretty smart eh? free market isn't much fun is it?

[Straylight]

free market isn't much fun is it?

I don't see a lot of fun for Gates in the future...

The fall of Microsoft has already begun -- certain Linux distributions (such as Mandrake) are fairly user friendly if you have suitable hardware -- and a lot of businesses are making the switch because Linux is FREE!!! unlike a M$ site license.

China plans to develop its entire software industry on linux. This could well lead to a chain reaction - games companies and home software developers will start to code for the Chinese audience and release linux versions. Slowly home users everywhere will release they no longer need microsoft...

<-- Gates

Of course this is but a geeky dream...

[inkhana]

Heh, what seemed kinda funny to me was I heard that the software they're using in the Mars exploration robots is based in Linux somehow (course I couldn't give any intelligent details, but that's what I've heard) Linux, choice of NASA? hehe

I wish I knew enough about Linux to switch. Dad would never go for it though...<.< >.>

[Straylight]

Ink, if they'd based it on Windows, some script kiddies would probably be driving the thing around Mars by now.

[Shao Feng-Li]

what is linux, mandrake?

Well bill gates did something right considereing hes a millionare, but dont mac computers cost a n awful lot? or is it jsut the goofy looking white imac?
at school they had nothong but mac, i wasnt doing anything major but it was a pain to use. and one time we had to use thoese goofy colored computers that are all fit into a the mintoer...
then again we've never owned a mac. my dads always built them from scratch. (wich results in some kick but power, and all microsoft programs) Can home made computers be built as macs?

[animenewstoday]

Well here is the deal I hate microsoft alot because there software is not free I also don't like mac and mac runs on unix. GNU i love and Linux i say Linux is better than all of the os that's out and freebsd is pretty good too

[shooraijin]

You can't really build Macs the way you build PCs (at least not anymore), since only Apple makes and sells the motherboards. Once you have a motherboard, though, you can install your own processors, RAM, drives and PCI/AGP cards, within the limitations of that particular board.

For example, helsinki, my warhorse Power Mac 7300, started life as a plain jane 180MHz PowerPC 604 (this computer was manufactured in 1997). I pulled the processor card and installed first a 400MHz PowerPC G3, then a 500MHz G3. I also upgraded the RAM from 64MB to 512MB, installed an ATI Rage 128 PCI accelerator (this was about three years ago), and installed a PCI card to add IDE, FireWire and USB (the Mac already had built-in SCSI and 10Mbit Ethernet). When I retired it as my workstation and turned it into a server, I pulled the Rage video card and replaced it with a 10/100 NIC, and installed NetBSD on it.

Similarly, my PowerBook 1400 started as a 1400cs/117 (a 117MHz PowerPC 603e). I installed a video-out option, a PCMCIA Ethernet card (with a driver I hacked myself, see http://www.floodgap.com/retrotech/mac/enet3c589/ ), a PCMCIA modem, a G3/333 CPU upgrade, extra RAM, and a new active matrix screen. Once I get around to it, I'll put a G3/466 in it, and maybe a bigger IDE notebook drive.

The point is that while Mac motherboards come only from one source, you still have some hackability. There's just certain upgrades that aren't possible on some models (like the iMac and eMac really weren't designed to be oozing power).

I'll let you in on a secret, though -- I like being the "other 6 percent" (depending on who you talk to) of the market, not the other portion. We get much less crappy software in the Mac world. People program either for the Mac because they either have enough money to do the port right, and/or they just like to program for it and they do the job right out of pride. Virus authors aren't going to bother with a marginalized platform, and even if they did, OS X is arguably more secure intrinsically than Windows anyway. Apple does a good job on the synergy of software and system, something not possible if they were the mass market monster. I think I'd have some of the same complaints about Apple that I have about Microsoft today if they ruled the market instead of Gates.

After all that, you can have my Macs after you pry them from my cold, dead fingers. My entire server network is now 100% Mac (after the SPARC's hard disk finally died), almost evenly split between PowerPC and 68K. I'll be getting in a Sawtooth G4 with my tax refund (yes!) to do network backup services. My dual 1.25GHz G4 kicks most Pentium 4 butt, and runs continuously for months on end without a crash (it only loses uptime because *I* reboot it, not because it panicked). Yes, I like thinking different.

[madphilb]

Actually what gates did wasn't right, just effective for his own gain.

Gates started off by buying some software cheap and selling it to IBM as DOS (Digital Research have been kicking themselves ever since, they where also up for the bid but didn't think much of IBM's PC).

Gates later took the system that Steve Jobs got form Xerox (who thought it was a waste of time and wouldn't be worth anything) and tried to copy it, Windows being the result... it took him till Win95 to even start to get it right.

While IBM had developed OS/2, word is that Microsoft would send people around the Computer Conventions and whatnot to badmouth the OS, why? OS/2 would have put Gates out of business, since it did everything that Windows was trying to do, but it actually worked. (at this point we still don't have Win95 yet).

All the while, ever since he first started Gates has been good at selling things that just simply don't exist. Gates overall isn't all that smart of a programmer, he's a real good salesman though.

While Win95 was being developed he ran his programmers into the ground. I read several articles in the, er.... Wall Street Journal about his programmers... really a sad thing... put some of them into therapy!

Gates has since done what he can to make himself the ONLY one you use, esp. on the PC. He's tried to hijack the web, network standards, and other such nonsense.

Now he's pushing for Trusted Computing, he's put Digital Rights Management into his software without the user having any control over it (to the point of it refusing to burn CDs for some people), he's repeatedly tried to kill off Netscape (now Mozilla) and Sun's Java.

And we haven't even gotten to the security issues yet. Almost every worm, virus, etc. that you hear about is due to using Microsoft's software for mail and web viewing. It's Microsoft's ActiveX, Microsoft's Scripting, Microsoft's old JavaVM engine that is the root of how these things spread.


Sadly I don't own a Mac.... but they worked from day one.... did what it was supposed to (while it took Gates over 10 years to get to the same point, and it's still far from secure or stable). Steve Jobs made the Mac hardware to run the OS from day one, so it's run far better than Windows ever could at the same time.


Oh, and BTW, No, I don't dislike Gates cuz he's rich.... it's because of how he made his money.

[ShiroiHikari]

I hated Mac at first, til I found my way around in the OS. Then I was like, "Hey...Windows really sucks...!" XD I had a Mac crash on me maybe three or four times over the course of about two years. I want a Mac, but they are a little more expensive than PCs. And I gotta settle with what I got right now...I could switch to Linux, but like that'd fly with my grandpa and nephew...o.O *needs her own computer*

[TheMelodyMaker]

A couple of months ago I got myself a new PC with Windows XP (just for a faster processor because swapping a 300 MHz processor for something faster than 350 MHz on the same motherboard couldn't be done), and I wasn't overly impressed with it. Most of my programs that I had used with Windows 98 for a while still worked okay in XP, but some didn't no matter what I did. So I tried using 98 and those programs which didn't work under XP worked fine. However, some of my other programs now wouldn't work under 98!

Tired and frustrated of switching between operating systems, I came up with a simple idea: Find a way to have both 98 and XP on the computer at the same time. The idea, however, was simpler than the solution. Creating multiple partitions didn't help because only one could be set as bootable. Installing one over the other didn't work either. After I was almost ready to give up, I came up with one last idea. Here's what I did:

1. Install a second hard drive. (Either one can be set as bootable through the BIOS settings; boot drive is "C" and secondary is "D", no matter which one boots first.)
2. Set original HD as boot drive. (The Windows 98 install CD upon bootup will think this as the primary HD anyway, whether or not it is specified as such in the BIOS.)
3. Install Windows 98 to boot drive.
4. Copy Windows 98 files (except swap file, that wouldn't copy) to secondary drive. This way it's fooled later into thinking it's on the same hard drive. ^_~
5. Reboot, reinstall Windows XP to boot drive from recovery CD included with system. (Windows 98 is now on the secondary HD, remember. ^_~ )

Now, all I have to do to switch between operating systems is to set the bootable HD in the BIOS. Setting it to "HDD-0" boots Windows XP, and "HDD-1" boots Windows 98. ^_^ (If I ever need to reinstall XP I can just set the BIOS to "HDD-0" and use the recovery CD, but if I need to reinstall 98 I'll have to start from scratch and reinstall XP as well.)

Leave it to me to do things the hard way, although it does pay off sometimes.

[andyroo]

I find that Macs are more stable, secure, faster, better looking, and easier to use and especially when getting error messages from what I remember than with Windows. I'm in the same boat as ShiroiHikari, but I have seen these used and have used them for a brief time at friends' houses and elsewhere.

...I could switch to Linux, but like that'd fly with my grandpa and nephew...

Well... I know that in Mandrake you can use a Windows themed X windows manager...

[Rashiir]

I believe that Macs are better than PC's for many reasons:

I find Macs to be very easy to use, and this is largely because of the intuitiveness of the Operating System. It's hard to understand unless you've gotten to use one for a little while. (And the ones at schools don't count. They're usually terribly maintained and horribly restricted.) But I have several friends who have made the switch from Mac to PC and they have said this:

"On a Mac, things work like you'd expect them to." This is hard to explain, but when you use one for a little bit, you'll get it. At first things won't work like you expect them to, because you'll be used to Windows, but once you get past Windows, you'll find that things work they way they really should work.

The virus/security hole thing is big for me. I am always relieved when I hear of some virus or security bug for Windows. Windows is really designed very sloppily and because of this, people are able to exploit it. There really aren't any viruses that affect the Mac.

Another issue is the price. Macs are more expensive, up-front. But I believe that when you factor in all of the wasted time and all the things you get with a Mac, it is definitely worth it. Plus, all of the software that is included in the package and the integration of the hardware and the software (Apple makes both, so they work together properly) make it a better deal in the long run, in my opinion. A good solid Mac will last you a long time.

[Straylight]

I like macs too. I don't think that they are "better" or "worse" than PCs, I just think they're better suited for multimedia (graphic design, film editing, sound production, etc.). One day, if I have a decent job and a good source of income, I'll be buying myself a mac for my music production hobby.

PCs do have advantages over macs in certain areas. The main one I can think of is that they're cheaper (good for hard up students like me). Also, you have far more options when it comes to customisation. I built my desktop PC from scratch and the hardware fits my requirements perfectly. It was also really cheap!

Also, more than one mouse button.

[shooraijin]

As a matter of fact, I use a two button mouse with my G4. It even has a scroll wheel, and Mac OS X didn't need a driver to use any of it.

[Straylight]

Do the extra buttons DO anything though, without having to manually assign them? Just curious.

[shooraijin]

The Mac automatically recognises the right button as a standard context menu button, and the scroll wheel works as you would expect.

[Fsiphskilm]

LOL you got it all wron

[shooraijin]

There are actually numerous articles in the Linux rags about how Apple is probably the best thing that happened to Linux. By becoming the biggest vendor of Unix workstations (really -- Apple is by far the biggest manufacturer, support vendor, and developer for Unix with the advent of OS X), Apple has significantly increased the mind and market share of other Unixy things like Linux and NetBSD, making it more palatable for people who aren't quite ready to jump to Mac, but do want to get away from Windows.

[Rashiir]

Do the extra buttons DO anything though, without having to manually assign them? Just curious.

Yah, like Shoobie said, it's a contextual menu button, just like the right click on a PC. Control-click does the same thing if you only have one button, but if your mouse is USB, you can probably just plug it in and use it for the Mac too.