Hey! Let's Christianize EVERYTHING!

[Hephzibah]

This shall be my last post in this thread, as it seems either I have struck a nerve, people just dont understand me, or they willfully take what I say and twist it. I think the middle one is the most likely, as we come from different countries and hence have different ways of communicating.

So magic is NOT the same as spiritual powers, and I think to reduce spiritual powers to the level of magic is slightly dangerous.

I am not reducing spiritual 'powers' to the level of magic. I believe that 'magic' IS spiritual. You obviously disagree, taking the viewpoint that magic is harmless and just entertainment, and not real. I disgree, passionately.

Now everyone seems to think that I am taking the viewpoint of "SECULAR = EVIL!!! CHRISTIAN SHOULDN"T DO THAT!!!'
I AM NOT!
I am saying WE HAVE TO BE CAUTIOUS!!! we are called to keep ourselves pure, and in my perspective 'magic', or any other thing like it, isn't!

Now the reason why this is my last post, is because it seems that people are taking offense to what I say, and as a result this thread is getting way off topic. Please forgive me, Heed, for causing this trouble in your thread.

[Heed]

Hey guys...

I appreciate all your opinions but let's please not lose our focus here. You don't need to defend or justify what you do to me or anyone else (EG: D&D, Magic: The Gathering, etc...) Just keep in mind that whatever you do, take before the Lord and makesure He is ok with it.

I want to also take this moment to be transparent: I also need to start apply what I am talking to you now. It is hard because I love vid. games etc... I am going to Japan to live there for over a month this summer becayse that is where my future ministry calling is. Anyway, I also need to do this, I think we all do. Don't do what you think, do what God thinks.

Anyway, one more thing. Please refrain from attacking eachother's opinions. Everyone is entitled to theirs but please don't lose focus. This is just a friendly reminder. Act as Christ would here. Just comment and don't argue over the petty things.

Thnks you guys, you are all awesome!!

[Heed]

In paragraph 2 above I meant we all have to be Christlike... not all go to Japan for the summer.. lol... I have trouble sometimes communicating.. :p

[Stephen]

Edit your posts rather then make more then 1 in a row.

[Mave]

I think that many (NOT ALL) Christians tend to take things of the world and mold them into something Christian. AKA Bandwagon** Copycats**

Anyway, I know for a fact that this turns off many (NOT ALL) unbelivers. I tend to think that there are a majority (NOT ALL) of Christians who lack originality. I am not saying that they aren't gifted, or creative etc... I am just saying that it seems that for many things (NOT EVERYTHING) in the world, there is a Christian "copy". I know that I have some Christian friends who feel the same way. Especially in music but I am more referring to everything.

I hope I understand what you mean. Do you mean you're frustrated with:

Plus One: Christian version of N-Sync/BSB
Stacie Orico: Chrsitian version of Britney Spears
Relient K: Christian version of eh....some secular equivalent I don't know of

Coz if that's the case, I personally do not find it too frustrating because it gives me alternatives to explore and enjoy.

I DO agree with you that it doesn't mean we should settle for anything mediocre or less creative. Neither should we limit ourselves to ONLY Christian things. I love some Christian music bands because they're talented to me, NOT because they're merely Christian.

Just because something is labeled 'Christian' isn't going to impress me.

But I think it is a sad day when I hear a "secular" song that is more uplifting and edifying than a Christian song. I have heard this many times.

That hasn't really happened to me...yet(?). Although I must agree, it is very sad. Most secular songs may seem more upbeat and fun to listen to but when I'm feeling down, guess what music I'm running to for solace and comfort?

But really, I see nothing wrong with Christianizing something if it means it's gonna improve it or make it more edifying/inspiring.

[DancingKana]

Relient K: Christian version of eh....some secular equivalent I don't know of

Umm... the closest I can think of is Weird Al...but that's not really right...Hmm...I do like Reliant K, though.

[Fsiphskilm]

[quote

[Warrior 4 Jesus]

Thanks to Larry Norman!

[Heed]

I never said that this is some new era. This is just the time I live in. It has been around for a while. Anyway, it is good to hear some response from the opposite side of the spectrum.

Keep the comments commin'

[termyt]

A lot of this discussion revolves around spiritual maturity. I hope we are all striving to become more mature spiritually, but we are all at different levels. I would urge everyone to take a moment and consider this before getting angry because (a) this person is doing this thing which is bad or (b) that person is can’t understand why it’s OK for me to do this thing.

It could very well be a good thing that some people abstain from everything that is not Christian. Perhaps their faith is not mature enough at this time to engage in secular activities with out being drawn away form Christ. I would hope that these people would not spend their whole lives in this state, but it could well be a necessary part of development. (If your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. Mark 9:45)

Other people, ones whom you could say are drunk on the freedom found in Christ, take way too much liberty and engage in activities that are not healthy. Hopefully, they will mature as well and understand where to place boundaries on their activities. (All things are legal, but not all things are edifying. 1 Cor 6:12)

More mature folks will fall between these extremes, joyfully partaking in the things that give them pleasure and abstaining from the things the lead them to sin.

For those who are less mature, it is difficult to understand why others who claim to be Christians either can do certain things or feel they need to abstain from certain things. This is where the idea of not being a stumbling block to the less mature comes in.

Now, we should all understand this as well. None of us are fully mature. Knowing this, when someone objects to the manner of living you are accustomed to, carefully consider it. It could be that that person is wiser than you in this area. It could be that you are wiser than they. Chances are, you can learn something from the exchange.

[Stephen]

Firemans Carry, remember the sites policy on politics. Posts like that will be deleted in the future.

[Yumie]

You know the thing that bugs me the most is whenever christians (or anybody really, but especially christians since we're supposed to be set apart) hold a double-standard on issues they believe to be right or wrong. Like, they have a book or a movie they like, but it has something in it that they don't believe to be morally correct. But they really like the book/movie, so they justify it-- they come up with some way to say it's OK when it's not. Then they see another book/movie that has similar content that they dislike and they condemn it. This especially bothers me when people confront them about it and they try to work themselves out of it, they continue to justify something that they've clearly stated that they hold as immoral. Even if its something I don't view as immoral like they do.

When I say I may not see it as immoral as they do, I don't mean something that is clearly stated in the Bible to be wrong-- like sexual impurity or something else that you can clearly find to be against the standards of the Bible. More like things along the lines of, "What kind of magic should be in movies? Just the Cinderella magic? Where do you draw the line?" I think the person that I most respect on issues such as I've just said would be a director at the summer camp that I work at. He does not watch ANY movie with magic in it-- whether that be Harry Potter or Sleeping Beauty. I disagree with him in that I watch movies with magic in them and I don't think it is morally wrong, but I think that as a christian he is really holding to the standards he believes in and is not being swayed. That's the kind of person I want to be.

Anyways, I can't really get my thoughts together well so I've just been rambling, but maybe somebody out there will half-way understand what I'm saying.

[Mangafanatic]

Relient K: Christian version of eh....some secular equivalent I don't know of

Mave! You speak blasphemy!!

Really, I do sometime get frustrated by Christian media becasue it feels as if people are just trying to squeezing God into their product. I notice this in books particularly. The plot doesn't really leave alot of room for God, so they shuffle events around, squeeze in a prayer here and there, and-- *poof* It's Christian!!

Personally, I think the kind of writters above should just write their stories and exibit their moral beliefs in the essence of their story telling. Give me tales with admirable, up right characters that I can look upto. Give me stories that aren't plagued by sexual filth and language. Give me stories with themes that resonate with the soul's longing for God. Personally, I think that those kind of stories will be more effective in reaching and impacting the lost than the kind of books you find on so many shelves in Christian book stores where God has been demoted to a poorly devised sub-plot.

[Yumie]

Yeah, me and Osaka discuss this a lot. . . really drives us crazy when you have an author who wants her/his book to be a christian book, so she/he throws in a short, "Dear God, please help me" every twenty pages and then continues with the plot. That's just sad. If God's that unimportant to you, just go ahead and let it be a secular book instead of a lame attempt at a christian one that has no christian meaning whatsoever.

[Heed]

Good opinions guys... I just wanna intrude here and say thanks for keeipng it civil. I know it's hard but thank you for keeping a Christ-like witness here. How you handle yourself in life and with others is your greatest testimony.

[Debitt]

Augh, I know exactly what you're talking about, Osaka-chan! I hate seeing books that are dubbed "Christian" just because there's prayer in it, or just because the characters are "Christians." Give me a book where I can see Christ reflected through the author, regardless of genre, THAT is what I call a true Christian book. Like Volt said: Christian books/music/anything isn't based on content but on the people who create them. ^_^; And it's my honest hope that people will see my writing like that when I finally work my way up to getting published.

[Dont-Lose-Heart]

hmm what i have to say is mostly about music
i listen to mostly christian music (mostly rock type stuff) and you know there isn't anything wrong with liking secular music though i do believe you should view it as what it is. That would be music that isn't written by someone who doesn't have a Christ centered heart and therefore the music wont either. That is why it could be used by the devil to lure you farther away from Christ unless you're mindful about it. I'm not saying that you should listen to mostly Christian music (unless doing otherwise proves to be a problem for you) because it of corse can be used to start conversations and make friends with people that you may have the opportunity to lead to Christ.
and about Christian music... praise music and hymns that's pretty much Christians only type stuff but those aren't the only kinds of Christian music there are. I'm more inclined to the alternative rock type stuff (my favorite genre is Ska) but anyways i wanted to say that just because modern Christian bands/singers are there doesn't mean that they are a copycat of anyone i mean Relient K really isn't a copy of anyone their style and sound has changed plenty since their start and they aren't there making rock music about Jesus to Christianize anything they're doing it because they love the music and they love Jesus so it shows in their music.
there are a great many Christian bands out there that dont sing about Jesus in every song or even most of their songs but they wont sing about anything contrary which is a good thing. My favorite band is Five Iron Frenzy they're a Christian ska band and they have many songs that arent about Jesus and a lot that are but that isn't the point they loved Jesus enough to show it in their music and God used them to lead a lot of people to Himself before they broke up (because they felt like God was calling each of them to do something else.)
hmm this ended up longer than i meant for it to be but thats okay
theres also a great deal of modern christian bands that feel like there shouldn't be a christian music industry and i tend to agree with them because if there wern't then a lot of christian bands could have more influence than just if you listen to it with an unsaved friend... i'm sure that in years past bands like Blaster the Rocket Boy (Sci-Fi horror themed old school punk rock) who's lyrics were just about always symbolic and Ghoti Hook (a little more modern punk) who were just fun loving goofballs would more than likely have had a much larger impact on people

[Nate]

Hey, if there was Christian classic rock, I'd probably listen to it, since that's about the only music I like.

Hey, wait, there is one song!

*jams out to "Jesus Is Just All Right" by the Doobie Brothers*

[termyt]

How about "Spirit in the Sky" by Norman Greenbaum? One of my al time favorites.

[Maledicte]

I have a personal distaste with most Christian novels...not for the added "please God help me" prayers but with lack of a real story. sadly most of these books are rife with cliche's and stereotypical characters, and even more sad, the fantasy/scifi novels are mostly glossed over allegories. Goodness, if I wanted an allegory I would have bought Pilgrim's Progress, for heaven's sake! That's my beef with all these Christian authors...most of them have such weak plotting and story elements, and but at least they're "safe". Thus, my Christian author's catalog is sorely limited. (Frank Peretti and Steven Lawhead are excellent, in my opinion.)

[Mangafanatic]

(Frank Peretti[, Ted Dekker] and Steven Lawhead are excellent, in my opinion.)

All element in [] might have been added my Osaka. . . maybe.

But I agree with you, ST2M. There is a very limited roster of truly effective, riveting Christian authors. *sigh* Why, why, why. . .

[Debitt]

Ah, Frank Peretti and Ted Dekker are awesome. The Christian elements of their stories don't interfere with the plot or the characters. Just how a good Christian novel should be.

[mitsuki lover]

I think what we have here is what is called the Grey areas.The areas where it's rather open to the indiviual Christian's own personal views wheter or not something is good or bad.Sadly though some Christians do try to turn personal
views into a litmus test as to wheter or not someone else is Christian or not.
We need to be tolerant when our views may differ from other Christians in the
Grey areas.

[EireWolf]

Very true, mitsuki lover.

It's fine if one Christian refuses to read or watch anything with magic in it, for example. If that is a conviction the Holy Spirit has given them, then they should stick to it. But they should NOT tell me that I have to refrain from reading or watching anything with magic in it. If they tell me that God forbids me to practice magic, however, that is clearly validated by scripture.

Another thought I want to add about all things Christian VS secular... "All truth is God's truth." That is a quote from a Christian musician/author/speaker named Jon Fischer. Secular media in itself is not bad. (I'm assuming most of us are here on CAA because of some affinity for anime... most of which is not inherently Christian.) Some examples of secular music, movies, books, etc. are very uplifting, full of truth, and inspired -- that's right, I said inspired. God can speak through anyone -- even a donkey.