Sex and sexuality and sexual orientation...

[Maledicte]

Going to try to touch on everything here. Wish me luck.

Just because you don't like to do "girly things" doesn't mean you're delving into some alternate sexuality. My mother, who is one of the most feminine women I know, grew up climbing trees, stealing garden vegetables and having play battles with her sisters using spiders, for Heaven's sake. Your hobbies, your dress code, are NOT a biological construct nor are they sexually related. They are constructs of society and tradition. Having a second X chromosome does not mean you HAVE to wear petticoats and not do sports.

I once posted a blog about something called "gender variant behaviors," which are entirely bull. Basically, if a girl likes horseriding, Lord of the Rings and having small breasts, she's practically a lesbian and a boy who likes the color pink and doing ballet is just about gay. Well, I guess that means I'm a lesbian then, toodaloo! This sort of thinking is a complete fallacy and based on old-fashioned gender roles. Even the Bible wasn't this stringent--Deborah was a judge and Lydia ran her own company. Had nothing to do with who they chose to sleep with.

So. Don't stress about your gender just because of your non-sexual preferences. They mean diddly squat in that regard.

As for your feelings about being a girl, (semifeminist mode ON) I think it has a lot to do with current ideas about being female in today's society and in some religious aspects. Let's see what we have here:

-Women are only good for having sex with men and having babies.
-Women should not enjoy sexual feelings and must only pleasure men.
-A woman who enjoys her body/sexual feelings is a slut.
-A woman must dress feminine/sexy.
-A woman who doesn't dress girly or enjoy "feminine" activities is a lesbian.

Etc, etc.

Given all this, it's almost impossible to see why anyone would enjoy being a girl. But you know what? All of them are false. Why would God choose to make half of the human population inferior? Woman is a HELPMEET for man--to do all the things he can't do, to make him complete. Different, but no less important. (And besides, Eve may have taken the fruit, but Adam was just as dumb.) In Proverbs, her children rise up (read: respect her) and call her blessed, and her husband does the same and praises her for all the work she's done. Her husband entrusts the household to her. She is motivated, intelligent, and makes good business decisions. She's also strong physically! Point this out to the people who think that women are inferior to men.

My personal belief about masturbation is that it's a-ok within moderation. It gives pleasure. That's it. It's like eating an ice cream sandwich. You eat it because it tastes good. But if you eat too much you become obese and rot your teeth. Reliance on masturbation can have a negative effect on your spiritual life (turning to sexual pleasure as a relief rather than appealing to God and working your way through difficult issues) and also your relationships with others. I don't believe that God would give men and women pleasure centers and then deny them their use because they hadn't found someone to share their bodies and lives with.

I also disagree that masturbation is only aided by visuals or fantasies. That's like saying that I need to read something while I eat.

Yeah, periods suck. Personally, I'm okay about it. The Bible says nothing against taking Midol or anything though. As for not appreciating your lower region...you take kung fu, correct? Count it a blessing that you will never have your balls kicked. Also, some women have mastered peeing while standing up, but it takes practice so I've heard.

About finding girls cute...I'm not sure how I'd interpret this. I think some of it has to do with media and advertizing. Sex sells, as long as it's female sex, and if a girl is offended by such imagery she's usually referred to as a frigid female dog. So we just accept it, and we even begin to like it and want it. I don't know, just throwing stuff out here.

Finally, prayer: I think RidleyofZebes has a good view on that. You know the cliche that Christianity is "a relationship, not a religion"? Well, it is true. You don't need any planned phrases in order to get God to listen to you, He knows already.

When praying, I don't think of it as any sort of premeditated thing, like a phone call you're obliged to give your great-aunt on her birthday even though you don't know her that well. For me, it's a bit more spontaneous. I'll be late for school, and the school parking lot fills up fast, so I'll think, "Oh no, I hope I can get a parking space!...say, God, could you reserve a parking space for me? Even if I don't get a close one I'll be fine with it. Thanks!"

It sounds ridiculous, and you probably think it doesn't have anything to do with the bigger issues in your life, but it's the little things that build up a great relationship. People who have longtime marriages and friendships can tell you the same. Just remember God in the little things--"Woohoo I bought this thing on sale and it was the last one! Thanks, God!" or "Thanks for letting that car NOT hit me!" or even weird non sequitur things like "That's so bizarre. I'm going to have to ask you about that once I get to Heaven," and when the time comes when you really need His power, comfort, and guidance in your life, you shouldn't feel so awkward for asking.

Ironically, I learned how pray from an issue of Amazing Spider-Man. If a comic book superhero can have a decent conversation with God, why can't I?

--
Wow, I've never felt so longwinded and pompous in my life, but I hope you can get something out of this schpiel. If you ever want, you can PM or IM me, and either way I'll be praying for you.

[NekoChan_C]

SirThinks2Much: Best. Post. EVER!!! Seriously. Not only do I agree with all the info you presented on the sexual identity issue, as well as the gender issue, but you actually made me think in regards to my position on masturbation... Can't say you changed my mind, but... certainly made me think.

[SP1]

A couple of things:

First is that you want the hormonal balance of a guy. Are you nuts? That means you are going to be impulsively whacked 24/7 instead of a few days a month. Maybe try flax oil instead.

Second. I had a discussion recently about a woman that was accepted into advanced degree work leading to a good career. The man she loved had proposed. Part way into the engagement, he starts printing out bible verses about how she needs to quit school and be the stay at home mom, because it's her biblical role. I was asked my opionion. Which was: dump this guy, if he's this bad now, it's just going to get more abusive later.

Lastly, despite all of the things you have listed, you sound like a very interesting person that I would be fine with calling friend. So I will certainly pray for you.

Keep working on prayer, it's a journey remember.

[beau99]

My personal belief about masturbation is that it's a-ok within moderation. It gives pleasure. That's it. It's like eating an ice cream sandwich. You eat it because it tastes good. But if you eat too much you become obese and rot your teeth. Reliance on masturbation can have a negative effect on your spiritual life (turning to sexual pleasure as a relief rather than appealing to God and working your way through difficult issues) and also your relationships with others. I don't believe that God would give men and women pleasure centers and then deny them their use because they hadn't found someone to share their bodies and lives with.

I also disagree that masturbation is only aided by visuals or fantasies. That's like saying that I need to read something while I eat.

I very much agree with you on this subject... and that's all I'm gonna say about that.

[Maledicte]

A few more thoughts...

I see quite a few people have mentioned a line in Song of Solomon on not awakening love, which they equate to masturbation. This is like saying that when a male lead bangs some random chick in an action movie, he loves her.

Sex =/= love.

In the KJV, the verse has some significant pronouns: "I charge you, O ye daughters of Jerusalem, by the roes, and by the hinds of the field, that ye stir not up, nor awake MY love, till HE please." (emphasis mine)

Geneva 1599 Bible: same verse, but with the pronoun "she" instead of "he."

Now I don't claim to know who or what we're referring to here, but it's certainly not a woman masturbating.

EDIT: I looked up this verse in a Hebrew-English Bible and it is also missing the pronoun. At any rate, why does this have to be specifically about sex? It could be about telling a girl to guard her heart (and body) so she won't go jumping after every guy she sees or pining after someone who's wrong for her. Good advice for either gender. The Song of Solomon is a controversial book that is usually seen as either a metaphor for Godly love or a romantic sex poem that anyone can relate to, so it's hard to extract a solid lesson from that, differing translations notwithstanding.

Also, there seems to be some confusion as to what asexuality is. Here is a good link on the subject: http://www.asexuality.org/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=section&id=6&Itemid=28
Their FAQ also has helpful information.

[Popsicle]

When I referred to the Song of Solomon verse earlier I wasn't specifically talking about masturbation being the only thing talked about in that verse. If you are guarding your heart, mind, and body from sexual temptations and if masturbation prevents you from doing that and you still do it, then that would be awakening love too early.

[Maledicte]

When I referred to the Song of Solomon verse earlier I wasn't specifically talking about masturbation being the only thing talked about in that verse. If you are guarding your heart, mind, and body from sexual temptations and if masturbation prevents you from doing that and you still do it, then that would be awakening love too early.

Sexual gratification can take many forms. My mistake.

And I do agree that abstaining from stimulating materials is the best way to go (referring to Minaki's issue with fanservice). You may think it's weird to ask God for help in your particular situation (not many girls I know are aroused by fanservice designed for men), but nothing is too weird for God. I've had some bizarre issues myself and prayer actually did work. The thing is to never believe that it's completely gone--think that way, and it will creep back in. It's a part of your life, but pray to God for strength in suppressing those tendencies, or even denying them unconsciously.

[EricTheFred]

I had a discussion recently about a woman that was accepted into advanced degree work leading to a good career. The man she loved had proposed. Part way into the engagement, he starts printing out bible verses about how she needs to quit school and be the stay at home mom, because it's her biblical role. I was asked my opionion. Which was: dump this guy, if he's this bad now, it's just going to get more abusive later.

QFT. The only worse than a control freak is a control freak who thinks he has God on his side. My wife went through an episode like this with one of her suitors prior to me.

Unless, of course, the guy was just communicating to her about his beliefs. If this was honestly a critical point in his beliefs, and she honestly didn't believe likewise, they would still be better off getting this on the table before the wedding, so they could agree to part ways. It's actually a good idea to have some solid concept of your prospective spouse's beliefs before actually saying "I do".

If a woman chooses a career outside instead of in the house, I personally don't see it as contrary to the Bible, but I don't feel like having a thread war today, so I'm not going to go into why. But, if she wants to have a successful marriage, she would be wise to marry a man who does not consider it some sort of sin.

[ShiroiHikari]

A few more thoughts...

I see quite a few people have mentioned a line in Song of Solomon on not awakening love, which they equate to masturbation. This is like saying that when a male lead bangs some random chick in an action movie, he loves her.

Sex =/= love.

THANK YOU.

[Sheenar]

THANK YOU.

Hmm...maybe that verse is not talking about "love" as in the emotion --maybe it is talking about sexual arousal---I'll have to go look up the original Hebrew for that word to see what it meant in the original context/culture.

I edited because that totally came out wrong. I wasn't trying to be "I am right, you are wrong." I was trying to say that we would need to take a look at the original language/culture to find out the meaning.

[uc pseudonym]

Believe it or not, I really tried to keep this post limited, given that it's not my thread.

First of all, sorry that we can't be asexual buddies. But I get the feeling you wouldn't like to be called an "asexual buddy" so I guess that's OK.

I'm ambivalent. I wouldn't care if I was some kind of aberration, but most of the people I've met don't feel the same. So I try to be a friend when possible, but if there's no common ground I can easily leave it at that.

Unless I really AM asexual O_O.

Perception is weird, so who knows? Labels aren't all that important anyway.

I'm wondering if there are drugs or surgery options that will make me stop having periods and hormone issues. I want the chemical balance of a man. Except that didn't come out right.

It's not like women have no advantages. Increased flexibility, lower center of gravity, stronger connection between halves of the brain, etc. I wish I could leech that last one off someone...

Why do people who have arranged marriages not get divorced? Oh wait, that's probably because they'd get stoned to death or something ._.

While our society does have a strange view of marriage, I think that in all honesty a lot of the divorce rate can be explained by one thing: people now have the idea that marriage should include love or happiness. Silly people.

You made me feel better, UC.

If I can ever help, you know how to contact me. If I'm ever not helping, you know how to stop me.

Also, there seems to be some confusion as to what asexuality is. Here is a good link on the subject: http://www.asexuality.org/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=section&id=6&Itemid=28
Their FAQ also has helpful information.

Yeah, AVEN. I wish them well, but back when I originally looked at their site I only got about this far:

Asexual people have the same emotional needs as anyone else

Now I need to go do something else before this thread completely erodes my conscience. No fault of anyone here, but that tends to happen when I read about this subject.

[Prince Asbel]

Just to clear up a misconception I may have given you, when I said masturbation was wrong, I meant in the context of stirring up mental imagery along with it which is followed by lusting and things like that. Take that out of the picture, and it's fine.

Thanks for the long response Prince, I really like that. It makes me feel like I'm not just spouting air.

Aw heck, I know it's not love =P To be honest to you and to myself, I hated that guy because I liked him, because I hated those weak, stupid, false feelings like affection for another human being. As emo as it sounds, I really despise human beings and clingy human relationships... I'm not looking for a relationship]

You're going to have to be clearer if you can. You hated him because you liked him with a clingy human relationship feeling?

P.S. Please don't shoot me in the head if you were being clear and I was too stupid to understand.

....Rant time. I feel like I want to be male for the same reasons that a poor person wants to be rich or a sick person wants to be healthy. Am I comparing being female to having a disease? Yes, and I know some people will find that offensive, but this is my opinion. Being a girl SUCKS. Having a period SUCKS. Having tons of boundaries and expectations set on you just because you were born with and without certain body parts SUCKS. (It doesn't help that I'm also Asian.) There's a reason that Mulan is my favorite Disney movie of all time.

Being a girl can suck. Culturally, I know girls have it rough. I mean, we each have our own physical problems, but the way people have treated girls nowadays is bad. You aren't valuable if you're not sexy, you aren't worth anything unless you're willing to raise a family, or your main goal in life is to obey and to please a man. I agree, those things suck. I know that culturally, men are not scrutinized near to the degree you are.

Oh, what does being Asian have to do with being born with and without certain body parts?

I think one of the reasons I hate being female and don't ever want to get married is really because of the Bible-- women must obey their husbands as slaves obey their masters, and while I know people will point out that husbands must be loving and humans are born equal, heck, there is NO WAY I'll willingly go into a relationship as the submissive and obedient role.

If God ordained it that way, then it is good from a Christian perspective.

But remember the 'If'. The only two points where men and women differentiate in roles they are not allowed to have is leadership in the church and making the final decisions in marriage. Plus, what men do and what women do are different, they are not inferior. I even have an article in my Apologetics Study Bible that agrees with me. So wives are not slaves to their husbands, you've got it wrong. That, or someone has created that impression for you. Heck, my own Mom and older sister have a messed up view of women's roles here on earth.

But if you don't want to be submissive in that regard, that's fine. That's not a sin. I wouldn't recommend getting married though, if that's your attitude. But while you're single, that's perfectly alright.

Some will call it pride and selfishness, and I agree, but why is it essentially OK for guys to have these traits while girls can't? I'm sorry. I've met tons of girls in church who believe that they are intrinsically inferior beings because they were created that way, from a body part, as a weak copy of a superior original, because of Christian teachings.

Those girls of yours are just plain wrong, like many Christian girls today. The reason men are leaders in marriage and in the church is because they are the ones picked for the job, not because we are superior. This is one of the reasons why one of my favorite sayings is "Theology Matters". People would lose a lot of these misconceptions if they just studied the Bible.

That just as Man is inferior to God, Woman is proportionately inferior to Man. All because some stupid, stupid woman thousands of years ago wanted a piece of FRUIT. I'm sorry, I'm ranting, I'm hysterical. That's because I'm a woman]

I need to rant too sometimes. But hey, women are not PROPORTIANATELY inferior to man. That is just plain nonsense. Federal Headship explains authority, it never implies (and in fact says the contrary of) women being like humans are to God. That is no less than stupid.

I'll go psychoanalyze myself and admit that I don't believe in loving marriage because I've never seen it in my house. I'm sure it exists somewhere. Love must exist as well. I'm also sure that it's possible for some people to lick their own elbows, but it's rare enough that it doesn't matter to me. More marriages end in divorce than in lasting union in America!

Love beyond the sexual? Of course there is. I don't know where you're living, but I'm attending a church in Ohio where it exists in heaps. I think you're just not looking for it, or you don't really know how to find it.

I probably have a better chance of being a millionaire than finding a good marriage, and, well, I can do a lot more with money than I can with a man.

Yes, I think that's true for you. Not everyone is cut out for marriage.

I'm just going to let the rest of the money thing go. I don't think it's terribly relevant now.

[quote="minakichan (post: 1242941)"]Thanks for the advice, guys. I still don't think my problems have been addressed (probably because the masturbation thing sidetracked things so much). I think it's because my sexuality problems are so... rare, and weird. I have no interest in sex, in humans, or in human relationships, but I think girls are cute and I get infatuated with people easily. So I don't blame y'all for not really understanding. 1%]

There's nothing that makes me frustrated than realizing I can't give an answer to a problem no matter how much study I would spend. Perhaps it is that you are not homosexual, but with all the other things... Dah. I'm realizing it even more now. I really wish I could address the issue myself and offer some real advice, but I can't. All I can do is repeat the same stuff like not staring at fanservice and finding some way of appreciating who you are, even if you don't like sex or marriage. I wish I could do more.

Anyway, God bless. I hope in some way or another this gets straightened out.

[Tsukuyomi]

Argh, I know what you mean about the,"You must be a submissive wife.." thing o.o Me and a friend had a fall out (of some sort) about that. I think it was what kinda drove a wedge between us o.o

"You must obey your husband."

The way that came across was like saying,"You must be your husbands slave." I don't think that's they way they meant it, but that's sure how it sounded to me o.o I know how the bible says that the place of a woman is at home, but what if she really wants to a career out of the home? Shouldn't the husband be understanding to let her do so without breaking her down and coming up with some compromise? Husbands must be loving and understanding right? So, why can't they be about this?

When I get married.. I don't want to HAVE to be submissive to my husband. I'd want to be that way, because I love him. That's the way it should be, because you WANT to. Not because you HAVE to o.o

Something tells me something's been twisted.. a lot o.O

(Sorry if anything I have said came out offensively. Twas not meant to o.o)

[Sheenar]

Argh, I know what you mean about the,"You must be a submissive wife.." thing o.o Me and a friend had a fall out (of some sort) about that. I think it was what kinda drove a wedge between us o.o

"You must obey your husband."

The way that came across was like saying,"You must be your husbands slave." I don't think that's they way they meant it, but that's sure how it sounded to me o.o I know how the bible says that the place of a woman is at home, but what if she really wants to a career out of the home? Shouldn't the husband be understanding to let her do so without breaking her down and coming up with some compromise? Husbands must be loving and understanding right? So, why can't they be about this?

When I get married.. I don't want to HAVE to be submissive to my husband. I'd want to be that way, because I love him. That's the way it should be, because you WANT to. Not because you HAVE to o.o

Something tells me something's been twisted.. a lot o.O

(Sorry if anything I have said came out offensively. Twas not meant to o.o)

The Bible doesn't say a woman's place is at home. Look at Proverbs 31 --the wife of excellence "considers a field and buys it, sells her wares in town", etc. She is a shrewd businesswoman in addition to being a noble wife.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Yeah seriously.

The notion of a woman "having to stay at home cooking/cleaning while the man is only obligated to work" is a mindset that absolutely disgusts me. It has no biblical foundation whatsoever, and is only considered "accepted" due to gender socialization in Western culture (And I guess many other parts of the world as well).

Really, I'd rather have a wife be submissive to God before she's submissive to me. And if anything, I'd definitely take her opinions and beliefs into just as much consideration as of my own.

[Tsukuyomi]

The Bible doesn't say a woman's place is at home. Look at Proverbs 31 --the wife of excellence "considers a field and buys it, sells her wares in town", etc. She is a shrewd businesswoman in addition to being a noble wife.

Hmmm, I guess this person left that part out o.O

I want to be someone's wife.. not their slave u_u

That goes both ways, btw.

[minakichan]

Snap, this topic is looooooooong. Seriously, I've been thinking of how to reply for a day ._.

Just because you don't like to do "girly things" doesn't mean you're delving into some alternate sexuality.

At what part does it start becoming... problematic? I've asked people, and they say that I'm definitely more like a boy than a girl.

It's like eating an ice cream sandwich. You eat it because it tastes good. But if you eat too much you become obese and rot your teeth.

OH SNAP.

But actually, I do enjoy ice cream sandwiches more than masturbation. However, the latter does not contain calories.

Count it a blessing that you will never have your balls kicked. Also, some women have mastered peeing while standing up, but it takes practice so I've heard.

Supposedly, getting kicked in the balls very hard feels like childbirth.
Also, this is good enough reason to want to pee boy-style.

"Oh no, I hope I can get a parking space!...say, God, could you reserve a parking space for me? Even if I don't get a close one I'll be fine with it. Thanks!"

I know people are going to blast me for being wrong, but I feel mecha uncomfortable praying to ask God for Stuff. I sort of get the same feeling as when my mom tells me to go ask her boss' friend's co-worker's sister's former roommate for a job, except it's like said person just randomly gave me a large sum of money for New Year's because s/he felt like it. I KNOW IT'S A BAD ANALOGY.

But I might have to find this Amazing Spiderman issue ._.

First is that you want the hormonal balance of a guy. Are you nuts? That means you are going to be impulsively whacked 24/7 instead of a few days a month.

At least I wouldn't start bawling and leaking fluids from my face when I can't get my bike lock open.

Lastly, despite all of the things you have listed, you sound like a very interesting person that I would be fine with calling friend. So I will certainly pray for you.

Heh thanks.

Also, there seems to be some confusion as to what asexuality is. Here is a good link on the subject: http://www.asexuality.org/home/index...id=6&Itemid=28

Ah, AVEN, I remember those guys. I have mixed feelings about them. On one hand, I think it's cool to at least have a base for asexuals, since other folks insist that they don't exist. On the other hand, do we really need ANOTHER sexual orientation minority activist group?

(not many girls I know are aroused by fanservice designed for men)

I'M SUCH A WEIRDO.
I used to be very raging femininst "MALES ARE OBJECTIFYING WOMEN" about it. I think that started to change when I met yaoi fangirls.

Increased flexibility, lower center of gravity, stronger connection between halves of the brain, etc. I wish I could leech that last one off someone...

These things still do not make up for lack of upper body strength in a fight. *sigh*

While our society does have a strange view of marriage, I think that in all honesty a lot of the divorce rate can be explained by one thing: people now have the idea that marriage should include love or happiness.

I'm kind of curious how and when in history this began to increasingly become a more prevalent belief.

No fault of anyone here, but that tends to happen when I read about this subject.

What does "this subject" refer too? Except you're probably not here anymore.

You're going to have to be clearer if you can.

I hate him because I like him. I'm too good to like people. That stupid jerkface, making me like him......

Oh, what does being Asian have to do with being born with and without certain body parts?

Asians can be even more traditionalist about gender roles. Sometimes.

The only two points where men and women differentiate in roles they are not allowed to have is leadership in the church and making the final decisions in marriage.

There's a female pastor in my church that speaks almost specifically to women because she relates the most, and she's been a blessing and helped me through all kinds of depression. She helped convince my mom not to get a divorce, but to continue on and pray for the best. My mom makes a lot of the household decisions because she's the one driving the kids to after school classes every day while my dad sits at the computer and plays online blackjack.

WHAT?

"You must obey your husband."

The way that came across was like saying,"You must be your husbands slave."

I think of "Children, obey your parents." In most cases, it's correct because parents inherently know more than their children. At the same time, there are freakishly retarded, terrible, abusive parents out there, and if disobeying them while they're drunk just so that a child can actually survive another day is a sin, then I say sin away. MEN DO NOT INHERENTLY KNOW MORE THAN THEIR WIVES. If my mom had followed this, my brother and I would be atheist. My dad's actually forbidden us to go to church several times before. I know someone's going to pull the "well, obey your husband in all things that are not unbiblical," but please, there are plenty of stupid-- but morally divorced-- things that my husband could tell me to do that I know aren't in anyone's best interest.

The notion of a woman "having to stay at home cooking/cleaning while the man is only obligated to work"

I'll obey any husband that tells me to exclusively cook and clean. Given my total fail domesticity skills, he will regret it for the rest of our short marriage.

[chibiphonebooth]

Supposedly, getting kicked in the balls very hard feels like childbirth.
Also, this is good enough reason to want to pee boy-style.

i'm just gunna pop on in here and say that is FREAKING AWESOME. HAHAHA. XD
but i'm a girl. ;_;

[Tsukuyomi]

That kinda looks fun o.o;

(Sorry, off topic)

[Nate]

But actually, I do enjoy ice cream sandwiches more than masturbation. However, the latter does not contain calories.

But it DOES contain chocolaty goodness!

Supposedly, getting kicked in the balls very hard feels like childbirth.

Actually I've heard childbirth is more like trying to push a watermelon through a hole the size of a lemon. At any rate, yep, I sure am happy at my lack of a womb!

At least I wouldn't start bawling and leaking fluids from my face when I can't get my bike lock open.

Uh, being a guy wouldn't necessarily change that... >.>;;

Won't, um, won't say why I know that. <.<;;

[Maledicte]

At what part does it start becoming... problematic? I've asked people, and they say that I'm definitely more like a boy than a girl.

More than half the time it's their problem. Just because more guys do it doesn't mean a girl shouldn't. I mean, look at WWII. Women took up TONS of jobs that mostly men had, started sports teams, joined the army, even worked on comic books while the men were away.

Deborah was a judge who fought and killed people.
The Proverbs 31 woman and Lydia were both business women.
Huldah was a prophetess, as were Deborah and Anna.

Also, what do you mean by "problematic"? When you have a problem with what you're doing, when you're doing something sinful, or when people complain about it and put you down?

(aside: once I was telling a friend excitedly about a violent poem I read in English class--she promptly told me "You're such a man." Hey, I like the movie 300 and read stuff like the Dresden Files, but at the end of the day I still have a vagina.)

But actually, I do enjoy ice cream sandwiches more than masturbation. However, the latter does not contain calories.

It can also help burn some of those calories.

In your words, OH SNAP.

Supposedly, getting kicked in the balls very hard feels like childbirth.

Women can give birth to, how many babies in their lifetime--20 max, with at least 9 months between each one? While men are perpetually in danger of getting the family jewels smashed if they don't wear a cup at all times, and they don't even need to have sex.

I know people are going to blast me for being wrong, but I feel mecha uncomfortable praying to ask God for Stuff. I sort of get the same feeling as when my mom tells me to go ask her boss' friend's co-worker's sister's former roommate for a job, except it's like said person just randomly gave me a large sum of money for New Year's because s/he felt like it. I KNOW IT'S A BAD ANALOGY.

Well, you already get stuff like air, water, food, gravity, ground, a roof over your head, the gift of eternal salvation, so what's a parking space compared to all that?

I tend to be a materialistic person, so a lot of my prayer-bites come from that. I like the tangible. If that makes you uncomfortable though, what about how you feel when you're making art? It's a gift from God. It's like He's giving you a little taste of what it's like to be Him *possible blasphemy. You can thank Him for the inspiration and talent He's given you. You can even pray while you're working on something. Even if it's easy to beat yourself up for not being "good enough." That's a tendency of all artists, I think.

But I might have to find this Amazing Spiderman issue ._.

http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/SpiderMan.html scroll a bit down the page to the J. Stracynzki parts.

I used to be very raging femininst "MALES ARE OBJECTIFYING WOMEN" about it. I think that started to change when I met yaoi fangirls.

Yaoi men are really flat-chested women. In the more popular fluff you don't even see their genitals. Just a white glowy area.
Yaoi character "types" usually follow heterosexual stereotypes.

We'd REALLY be objectifying men if we had hot shirtless men advertising beer, random department stores, Carl's Jr. hamburgers, AND women's fragrance. Also, a hot, scantily-clad man would be the only male character in an action movie solely for the attraction and appeasement of the female audience. And on billboards. Did you know that when that Travis guy for Calvin Klein showed up in briefs on a billboard, traffic got stopped up in that vicinity? I think half of it was because people were so shocked. (the other half was women drooling, obviously)

[ShiroiHikari]

As for asking God for things...He did say "ask and you shall receive". That's not to say that it's okay to be like "UM JEEZUS CAN I HAS CHEEZBURGER?" or something like that though. XD

[GeneD]

Mmm, this has been quite an interesting read.

I'm probably not going to remember half the things I wanted to say while reading through this, but here goes. I apologise in advance for such a long post.

I'm not going to cover masturbation, since it has already been discussed and it wasn't your main concern. I think why many people addressed it is because it was the last thing that you mentioned in the first post and so it sticks in people's minds.

I hate menstruation, I hate PMS...Having a period SUCKS

QFT I totally agree with you. My mom recently got a hysterectomy and won't ever have this problem again. I am [color="Green"]green[/color] with envy.

As for not wanting to be a girl regarding the emotional side of things. I once again agree with you. While I don't really have a desire to be a guy, I'd certainly like to have my heart removed and replaced by a second brain. It would certainly uncomplicate some things. I think this is where hating a guy because you like him comes in.

To be honest to you and to myself, I hated that guy because I liked him, because I hated those weak, stupid, false feelings like affection for another human being. As emo as it sounds, I really despise human beings and clingy human relationships... I'm not looking for a relationship]He makes you feel emotional and that makes you vulnerable. Being vulnerable sucks and can be very scary. He has the ability to make you act differently from the way you are used to and on top of that he has the ability to hurt you, sometimes without even knowing it. Outrageous isn't it! From what I've read you seem to be pretty independent and this kind of dependency on a guy understandably frustrates you.

Not having a good example of a successful marriage/romantic relationship also aggravates the situation, since maybe the only examples you have are of people getting hurt. I don't believe marriage is a sham and love doesn't exist, I am lucky enough to have my own parents as an excellent example, but I acknowledge that there are false and shallow versions of these things in the world. Not wanting to partake in these is not wrong, but try to learn about distinguishing between the two. God's part in a relationship is also very important and can make all the difference. *Cough cough* I don't actually have much practical advice concerning this, but that's just my insight into the situation.

Submissive wives: it seems to me that being submission is very often equated to being a doormat and a slave. If that is the case, then I too don't want any part of that and any guy who thinks I'm going to stay at home all day, cooking and cleaning, has another thing coming. But that doesn't mean I will be a rebel and question everything my husband does. I wish to respect him and honour him, which is what I understand by submission. I know that may not be the way the world sees it, but that is my opinion. I believe surrendering to God is also a form of submission, but humans aren't God's slaves. It's about mutual respect.

That said, however, if a woman chooses/wants/enjoys it to be a stay-at-home mom, I can't judge her either. There are parts of our society that seem to look down on women, strong, beautiful, Godly women, who decide not to have a career or get pregnant again after already having 3 children. I don't think those women are weak, if that's what they chose for themselves and the calling God has placed on their lives. Situations of abuse by husbands are obviously another story that I'm not going to go into now.

Um...okay, what's next? Asexuality: Please forgive me if my thoughts (I won't call it an answer because it isn't) on this are totally incoherent, but I'll give them anyway.

Is it still sexual desire if I don't ever want to have sex, have no interest in it, and think it's disgusting though?

I think to a degree, yes, it is. I'm going to assume that by "not wanting to ever have sex" you mean this as a conscious decision. So as a human you come with a build in, biological "sex drive" just like you come with emotions and all those fun, hormonally related things. See what I mean?

Bad analogy time: If I decide I won't drink any water/liquid anymore, my body is eventually going to object and show symptoms to my "not wanting to ever drink water". So even if you decide you are not interested in sex and it in fact disgusts you, there may still be some residual sexual desire, which could also be what's causing some of the confusion. On a side note: this "residual sexual desire" would probably be a lot worse if you were a guy. But I might be stereotyping.

I' also like to point out that I don't think not being interested in sex is in any way wrong.

Female fanservice:

Looking at pictures of cute or sexy girls excites me more than looking at the same of boys... at the same time, I don't know if it's sexual arousal or not

You say it "excites" you. That speaks to me of some kind of desire and ties in with what I said above.

As for liking girl fanservice more...I don't think you should write yourself off as a lesbian or bisexual just yet. I believe those things speak of a lifestyle and much bigger things than female fanservice. To be very, very honest with you, you are not completely alone in this area, I too sometimes find myself more attracted or "excited" by cute/sexy girl fanservice. There, see, I too am a weirdo freak etc sometimes. Maybe it's just the two of us, I don't know. Not that guy fanservice isn't a factor (for me, so I guess I have it easier), but you must also take into account that our society emphasises female fanservice more and there is a lot more of it around.

Personally, if I get excited/aroused to the point where it becomes a desire of the flesh and something not from God, whether it is male or female fanservice doesn't matter, if it causes me to stumble. Once again I don't have other advice about this, except as already said, if the fanservice causes you to stumble or sin, it's best to avoid it and not indulge in that behaviour. If you are uncertain whether to see it as a stumbling block or potential sin, it would be best to sort that out between you and the Lord. Hopefully the advice on prayer given in this thread will help you in that regard.

Another option might be just to leave it/stay away from it for a while.
To stretch the ice-cream sandwich example; if I eat too many it will start having an adverse effect on my body, but I might not notice it; say I don’t own any mirrors or I have no-one to compare myself too or I gradually increase my intake so that I don’t really notice the effects over time (trying to think of plausible “why I wouldn’t noticeâ€

[uc pseudonym]

At what part does it start becoming... problematic? I've asked people, and they say that I'm definitely more like a boy than a girl.

I don't think there's any way to objectively judge "like a boy" or "like a girl." Both are relative and vary greatly.

These things still do not make up for lack of upper body strength in a fight. *sigh*

I don't know about you, but I use my brain to speak a lot more often than I use my arms to fight.

I'm kind of curious how and when in history this began to increasingly become a more prevalent belief.

I'd personally blame the middle ages where we have church-state union and many of the clergy are secular people with no religious training - hence culture becomes religion. But there are some who would be irritated at me for saying that.

What does "this subject" refer too? Except you're probably not here anymore.

The leaving was temporary; I try not to walk out on threads. "This subject" = "sexuality."

[minakichan]

But actually, I do enjoy ice cream sandwiches more than masturbation. However, the latter does not contain calories.

But it DOES contain chocolaty goodness!

Masturbation contains chocolaty goodness?

Uh, being a guy wouldn't necessarily change that... >.>;;

I don't get it *sad*

When you have a problem with what you're doing, when you're doing something sinful, or when people complain about it and put you down?

The sinful part. The Bible says that it's bad to "wear the garments of the opposite sex" or something like that, right? (I'm not talking about pants XD) Doesn't this mean essentially that a woman should not try to be a man? Aw heck, it's not like I'm good at trying to stay sinless anyway.

It can also help burn some of those calories.

In your words, OH SNAP.

Do I really say that a lot? XD

We'd REALLY be objectifying men if we had hot shirtless men advertising beer, random department stores, Carl's Jr. hamburgers, AND women's fragrance. Also, a hot, scantily-clad man would be the only male character in an action movie solely for the attraction and appeasement of the female audience. And on billboards.

MMMMMMMMMMMMM. I mean, uh........
But we have hot shirtless women advertise these things? I didn't know that o.o

That's not to say that it's okay to be like "UM JEEZUS CAN I HAS CHEEZBURGER?" or something like that though. XD

My one desire in life has just been shot down XD

My mom recently got a hysterectomy and won't ever have this problem again. I am green with envy.

DO WANT. GIMME GIMME.
Well, not quite, it wouldn't solve all the problems, right?

He makes you feel emotional and that makes you vulnerable. Being vulnerable sucks and can be very scary. He has the ability to make you act differently from the way you are used to and on top of that he has the ability to hurt you, sometimes without even knowing it. Outrageous isn't it! From what I've read you seem to be pretty independent and this kind of dependency on a guy understandably frustrates you.

Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head. Frustratingggggggg grrrrrrr.

Submissive wives: it seems to me that being submission is very often equated to being a doormat and a slave.

Let me put it this way: If I get married, I want to be the husband. I want to make the household decisions and I want HIM to submit to ME. That doesn't mean that he has to do all the cooking and cleaning necessarily, but I I HAVE to wear the pants in such a relationship. Why? Because I'm a selfish anal control freak. Which probably means that I'll never have this problem.

I'm going to assume that by "not wanting to ever have sex" you mean this as a conscious decision. So as a human you come with a build in, biological "sex drive" just like you come with emotions and all those fun, hormonally related things. See what I mean?

So it's like intellectually I don't want to have sex, but biologically I do?
Is that why some rape victims still feel pleasure at it? ._.

As for liking girl fanservice more...I don't think you should write yourself off as a lesbian or bisexual just yet. I believe those things speak of a lifestyle and much bigger things than female fanservice. To be very, very honest with you, you are not completely alone in this area, I too sometimes find myself more attracted or "excited" by cute/sexy girl fanservice. There, see, I too am a weirdo freak etc sometimes. Maybe it's just the two of us, I don't know.

Let's be weirdo freaks together!
I don't want to say that guy fanservice doesn't excite me too-- that would be a lie. I've just found that I stare at and check out girls far, far more than I do boys. I would also rather see a girl scantily clad than a boy half-naked. Thaaaaaaaaat seems kind of creepy. As for whether I'm lezzy/bi, I really don't know. I've kind of abandoned labels through this thread because I don't know if they're accurate anymore.

Maybe if you take a break and you notice that you seem to have an unhealthy craving for it or maybe that it lifts a weight off your shoulders, you can more accurately access how the fanservice is affecting you.

Hrmm I guess I'm just being hormonal. Siiiiigh I guess I should block *****... My excuse for not doing so was Anime/Cute, but that's so filled with cute girls anyway, so it certainly didn't help.

Thanks for the long response, GeneD ^^ I really like long responses!

I don't know about you, but I use my brain to speak a lot more often than I use my arms to fight.

Well, generally I use my mouth to speak... (OK SORRY I'LL STOP ACTING RETARDED)
But I feel like the brain differences between women and men are either neutral or lean in men's favor. Aren't men wired to be better at problem-solving and logic? That's not to say that women are going to be worse or that men can't be creative, but I'm just saying that if there are brain differences, women don't luck out as a result.
But I like to fight. ._. And I like to win, or at least feel effective.

[Mave]

Hello,

I'm not fond of being a girl sometimes (e.g. menstruation sucks, emotional ups and downs etc.) but I try not to think that the grass is greener at the other side because the grass at my side is a different type of green and if I can't go over to the other side - why waste time thinking about it? LOL

How are things in your life in general? Some of us are pulled into the fantasy world because we're very unhappy with reality. I'm guilty of staring at pretty and handsome guys because I wish I could be like them - perfect figures, facial features etc. I read romance stories because I don't have a bf and wonder how if feels like to be those 'lucky' characters who have everything perfect. I read sexual-driven stuff because I've never had sex before and wonder how it feels like to have all that pleasure.

I guess my point is not about whether what is right or wrong. It's more about us finding our identity and fulfilment in life through God. I pray that you'll find your identity as God's child and allow your sexual nature to be taken care of by Him. Offnote: I found it interesting that you wanted to be the one in a relationship to "wear the pants". Out of curiosity, do you expect the same in your relationship with God as well? Who calls the shots in your relationship with God? Reason I ask is because until the day I can completely submit to God, I will not be able to submit to my husband.

It's extremely difficult to control our sexual nature. We are all born with abnormalities (aka sin) so why should we be surprised if we're born with strange sexual tendencies? I find my weaknesses in unhealthy sexual desires. It's so easy for me to have my judgment clouded (it's natural to do, it's not harming anyone, no one will know etc etc) but in the end of the day, we have to make the decision and bring the matter to God.

As bold as it sounds, YOU make the decision for yourself. Who are you? What do you want to be? Do you want to be hetero or do you find comfort in allowing the world to give you alternate labels - an asexual, a homosexual, a bisexual or sex pervert,...ok whatever and then, letting your whole life dictated by said label? I don't know, I just find it weak to simply accept things for what they are. I mean, just because I struggle with sexual desires, doesn't mean I'm going to say "Ah well, looks like I'm a pervert in nature. Nothing I can do about it." Personally, I want to be hetero and to have healthy control over my sexual desires (aka it doesn't dictate my life).

So I think, it's not about what you are, it's about what you truly want to be (we sometimes say this is what God intended for you ). Once you're made that decision, bring it to God and seek agreement with His Way. We can't be what we want on our owns, we need God's help. So, always try to work things out with God and (humbly) ask Him to help you so that you'll be molded by Him.

Dear God, you know all of us are weak in the flesh. Pls help us to be brave, to stand up for what we should be and want to be. Pls reveal what you really want us to be - would you like us to be strong believers who are firm and have self-control or would we be weak-minded, toss around the waves. Pls give us the courage to reject things that are worthless and to find true joy in the many blessings you shower us. Lord, you know our struggles are always uphill in nature so we seek your Hand in all matters. We surrender our lives to you, even this area of sexual desire. Pls take it and give us the strength and peace that Jesus had when He resisted temptation. We want to be like Jesus, to overcome and be victorious! Thank you, Father ~

[Nate]

Masturbation contains chocolaty goodness?

Wait crap. I so totally read that wrong. And wrote that wrong. This is what I get for posting ten minutes after I wake up. Woooooo.

I don't get it *sad*

I am a guy and you have no idea how many times I have broken down in tears when I was frustrated by something. If you want to become a guy to avoid that, then I'm here to tell you that being a guy won't help you avoid that.

So it's like intellectually I don't want to have sex, but biologically I do?
Is that why some rape victims still feel pleasure at it? ._.

That could be it, and also don't forget about Stockholm Syndrome.

As bold as it sounds, YOU make the decision for yourself. Who are you? What do you want to be? Do you want to be hetero or do you find comfort in allowing the world to give you alternate labels - an asexual, a homosexual, a bisexual or sex pervert,...ok whatever and then, letting your whole life dictated by said label?

Okay, I'm going to just let it out here a bit, and whatever. But speaking as a person who suffers from a sexual abnormality, I can say it isn't that simple. I don't make the decision of what I am. That doesn't mean I accept what I am, I want to change, but it isn't a switch you flip on and off.

So many people think homosexuality is a choice, but that doesn't explain. Why are there homosexuals who desperately want to change but can't seem to? Why are there so many that cry in frustration, saying they just want to be normal? Can't they just "choose" to be normal? No, they can't.

Calling it a choice doesn't explain why some homosexuals put themselves through torture desperately wanting to be normal and never achieving it. It's almost insulting to say that these people just didn't want to be normal hard enough. Until you suffer from a sexual abnormality you simply can't understand. It's much like how I can't understand kleptomaniacs, or compulsive gamblers, or alcoholics.

It frustrates me to see someone saying "You're just letting a label dominate your life!" I don't think people can be defined by labels, but labels DO have their uses. It helps us to understand someone and their struggles, most of the time. Some people hide behind labels, but that's the problem of the person, not the label.

The human brain is a very complex thing. While there is a spiritual aspect that we can't quite understand or define, our brain IS a physical thing, and there can be physical abnormalities, or damage that CAN change who we are, and we can't do a thing about it. Proof of that is Alzheimer's Disease, which currently has no cure. These people lose their entire lives, their ability to do practically ANYTHING. It's not a matter of how hard they want to remember how to do stuff or who their family is! The fact is they CAN'T. No matter how strong their desire, no matter how strong their faith, no matter how hard they try they CANNOT. Because the physical damage does not allow it.

God can help us. He certainly can. And He can cure us of whatever ailment we have, even sexual abnormality. But the point is sometimes He DOESN'T. Sometimes a person has to live their whole lives with a certain affliction. It doesn't mean they've accepted it, or that they're not trying, or that they're not faithful enough. It just means God has His reasons that we, as humans, can never fathom. I certainly don't expect to be cured of my sexual abnormality. If I am, hey, great. If I'm not, I'm not going to just embrace it, I'm going to fight it to the day I die. But I will always identify myself by it, because no matter how much I hate it, it is part of who I am.

And there goes my rant.

[Tsukuyomi]

Let's be weirdo freaks together!
I don't want to say that guy fanservice doesn't excite me too-- that would be a lie. I've just found that I stare at and check out girls far, far more than I do boys. I would also rather see a girl scantily clad than a boy half-naked. Thaaaaaaaaat seems kind of creepy. As for whether I'm lezzy/bi, I really don't know. I've kind of abandoned labels through this thread because I don't know if they're accurate anymore.

*Sneaks back in* >_>

I think that's because girls have more.. "Stuff" to look at o.o]Well, generally I use my mouth to speak...

Lol, I was going to say that.. xDD

(you guys (Mods) can delete this post if need be)

[minakichan]

(Whoaaaaaaaa Mave, you're in/from Singapore? That's so coooooool... I have a bunch of new Singaporean co-workers. Do you sometimes end your sentences with "la" and "sia" and "hor" and stuff? XD)

How are things in your life in general?

Life is OK, usually, which might seem weird with all the complaining I do. Ummm, I have insane mood swings. Good weather can make me hyper for a whole day, while my time of the month will make me emo and impulsive enough to post stuff like this topic.

Offnote: I found it interesting that you wanted to be the one in a relationship to "wear the pants". Out of curiosity, do you expect the same in your relationship with God as well?

My obsession with pants stems from something like this: obviously, I can't wear the pants with God and there aren't any pants anyway. But God is 923492387898273102019283x awesomer than me, so submitting to him makes sense. Boys are not 923492387898273102019283x awesomer than me, so I don't see why I have to be the sub. I bet I can be at least 1.5x awesomer than my husband if I try, so I want to be the dom. I just don't think it's fair. I think I can make decisions just as well as any other person. I would make a slavery analogy, but I won't.

Do you want to be hetero or do you find comfort in allowing the world to give you alternate labels - an asexual,

First of all, while I agree that asexuality can be considered an alternate sexual orientation, I don't personally see a problem with it at all and I don't consider heterosexuality necessarily superior to it, but I suppose I shan't say more on the topic. As for labels, I still don't have one yet for myself... I've been accused of being lesbian before, but I don't know. I feel like I'm very indecisive about this stuff. I still can't even decide where I stand on the political spectrum ._.

I am a guy and you have no idea how many times I have broken down in tears when I was frustrated by something. If you want to become a guy to avoid that, then I'm here to tell you that being a guy won't help you avoid that.

BUT GUYS MOCK ME FOR THIS. I DO NOT COMPREHEND.

rant

At this point, I don't know if I have a sexual abnormality or just hormones or just major PMS, so I don't know how to respond ._.

[Sheenar]

Hmm...maybe that verse is not talking about "love" as in the emotion --maybe it is talking about sexual arousal---I'll have to go look up the original Hebrew for that word to see what it meant in the original context/culture.

I looked up the word "love" in Song of Songs 2:7 in Strong's Concordance and in the original Hebrew it means the following:

'ahabah {a-hab-aw} f of 0158; TWOT - 29c; n f AV - love 40; 40 1) love 1a) human love for human object 1a1) of man toward man 1a2) of man toward himself 1a3) between man and woman 1a4) sexual desire 2) God's love to His people

Gematria: 13

So kind of a broad spectrum of things...


Minakichan, it's perfectly acceptable to not marry. No one is saying that you must. In fact, Paul encourages people not to marry so they can focus on God. (Unless they burn with desire--then better to marry and not sin) Maybe you have a leaning towards a celibate life?