Death Note: Who seems more autistic?

[rocklobster]

I've noticed there are three autistic-seeming characters on Death Note. Is it just me, or do Mellow, Near, and L seem autistic to you guys. Here are the warning signs they exhibit:
1. Obsessive-compulsivism (Mellow and L both have major sweet tooths. Near is always seen stacking stuff like dice and toys)
2. They never make eye contact with people who are talking with them.
3. They are all extremely intelligent.
4. They exhibit a high sense of morals (ok, so Mellow doesn't qualify here. Unless [spoiler] my theory that he is secretly working alongside Near is correct. [/spoiler].
Even so, kudos to the creators! They must've done a lot of research on autism to pull these traits off right.
To help you people out, here's a link to Wikipedia's article on autism.

[Sheenar]

The traits you describe would point more to an Asperger Syndrome diagnosis rather than full-blown autism.
These characters have no deficiency in verbal development, just in social development --hence an AS diagnosis.

[mechana2015]

I don't think any of them are. If aspergers was even close, I'd say that Mello is not even on the map for that... Nears the closest and L is only borderline at most.

OCD would be more along the lines of constantly checking something or repeating something (usually an action), not a preference in food... if anything it makes them just diabetes risks. Near might be OCD, but many normal people have thinking tics like playing with pens or doodling that don't make them OCD.

Intelligence has nothing to do with autism either... thats Savantism, which happens in concert with autism at times but is rarely a direct symptom.

To quote your article there.

"Autism is a brain development disorder that impairs social interaction and communication, and causes restricted and repetitive behavior, all starting before a child is three years old."

Every character you mentioned is a master communicator and social observer. Not meeting the eyes may seem to be an issue, but the degree that they understand human nature and mental function and their ability to observe other humans actions and use those to form predictions and act on those predictions to manipulate other humans behaviors flies directly in opposition of all that defines true autism.

In short, autism's most common symptom is a lack of ability to predict another persons reaction or to empathize with them, resulting in social difficulty due to the inability of the autistic person to 'read' a person. This is the exact opposite of what L, Mello and Near do. If anything they're savants and intuitive psychologists/sociologists. This at times makes people eccentric, but by no means autistic.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Intelligence and a high sense of morals aren't qualifications for autism or Asperger's syndrome, so I don't see why those would matter. *Has the DSM-IV*

[Ingemar]

I think you underestimate how debilitating a condition like autism is. Many autistics are unable to speak and those that do have very bizarre speech patterns with improper inflection. They have almost no ability or drive to function socially on the most basic levels and have an odd habit of self-stimulation.

[minakichan]

http://deathnotes.kefi.org/essays/vvoltaire_las.html

(yeah sorry, frames suck)

People have said this before, but I highly, highly doubt that Ohba specifically aimed for this. Remember than Ohba originally wanted L to be a sophisticated bishonen but only changed the character personality after seeing Obata's whimsical concept art.

[mechana2015]

I think one of the biggest fallacies of the argument presented in that link, Mina, is that we never see L outside of work. We never see him AWAY from the investigation, in the manga, anime or movies, so we never see him outside of an investigation, so we do not actually know how much of L's comments are acting in the cause of investigation. He essentially is an under cover operative for much of it, and so we do not know if ANYTHING he said or did in the manga is 100% true to his nature. We have such a thin sliver of a behavior sample from him, I don't think you could reliably diagnose him with anything without making serious speculation.

[rocklobster]

I guess it's easy for me to underestimate autism/Aspergers since my situation with it isn't as debilitating as it is for others. But then, I'm a mildly autistic person, so I guess that might be why I have it easier than some.

[minakichan]

I think one of the biggest fallacies of the argument presented in that link, Mina, is that we never see L outside of work.

To be honest, that one's not one of my favorite essays by a long shot, and not just because of the writing style. I did just want to show that people have thought of this before.

I think L is an alien.

[mechana2015]

I don't think any essay, no matter how well argued, could, for the reason I stated, accurately diagnose any of the mentioned characters. The only character mentioned in this poll we ever see outside an investigation is Near and only for... a matter of minutes before he's notified of his involvement. Its like judging an undercover police officer based on their undercover persona, which would be completely unreliable.

Unless other stories have been presented by the original author(s) depicting the normal day to day life of the aforementioned characters... any speculation on the day to day functioning of any character in the series is merely wild speculation in absence of such, except for possibly Light and his family. We don't even see any of the investigative team members (arguably normal people) outside of the investigation.

[Roy Mustang]

In my view, I don't think L has exhibit a high sense of morals at all. He may not be a killer like Light is, but him and Light have the same kind of view of what they think is sense of good morals (which they are not) and will stop at nothing to make their goals happen.

[font="Book Antiqua"][color="Red"]Col. Roy Mustang[/color][/font]

[Nate]

I agree, L has practically no morals whatsoever. He believes very strongly that the ends justify the means, remember he willingly sacrificed a person's life just to get an idea of where Kira lived. He invaded people's privacy. He lied about things frequently. He did all these things without seeming the least bit sorry or remorseful.

Yes it was good that he wanted to stop a killer, but the complete disregard for the law and for human life proves if he has morals, they are warped and twisted to a degree that they can no longer be called morals in my opinion.

Plus we also have to remember L was hired to do a job: catch Kira. His strong desire to catch Kira may have NOTHING to do with a sense of morals. In fact, this is likely the case, he only cared about doing the job, not about whether it prevented more killings. He probably would have allowed thousands more people to die so long as he could be 100% sure he could catch Kira.

[Hana Ryuuzaki]

[font="palatino Linotype"]None are what you deem to be "autistic". Believe me, I would know.

I've worked with two Autistic kids (and one with Aspberger's) for about 5-6 years of my life.

None exhibit true signs of Autism.

Rock, those four reasons you listed could be for any normal OCD person.
Those don't necessarily mean that they're Autistic.

They would have to have MAJOR social anxiety/verbal ineptness/some ticks that set them off.

*shrugs*
That's what I think.[/font]

[Nami]

Well, I rarely ever get invovled in these kinds of things because people tend to get mad at me.. but I am going to state my opinion and if you feel you must get mad at me.. or counteract me.. don't count on me to reply back ^^ I am just saying this.

First off; L has different morals than anyone else, he is an investigator who has suffered from having to make difficult choices. He has to make choices that normal people could never make, let's not forget that by the time we see him in the anime/manga he is already a very well versed investigator. Which means he has already done many, many cases. As you say, L may not have the same morals, and perhaps they are twisted a bit, but I do not believe he would ever have more people killed ((Than necessary)).. if that were true, then he probably would have let Matsuda die if it seemed like he would help if he died. But L showed concern even though he was annoyed, L let the people die that he did to test a theory, now do you think he could have talked to these people and told them; "Hey, do you mind if you die for my theory?" wouldn't that have been worse?

Also, Light is screwed up thanks to Ryuk, and holds a very, very, very twisted sense of justice and by the end of the Manga believes himself to be god. Ohba says so himself in the "How to Read Death Note 13" that he really didn't like Light in the least, and said that he needed to go. The only reason he put the ending the way he did was because he didn't want to the Light fans to hate him. Sorry Light fans, he isn't coming back... ask Ohba.

L holds more of a sense of Justice, the right kind of justice, than Light. When the Chief decides to quit the Police force, L tests them by telling them they should go back, they may die and he doesn't want that to happen, so he lets them have a choice. L shows compassion here, he doesn't want the people he has been working with to die. Even if he didn't tell them about the money he had to cover them, he wanted them to make their own choices, if that isn't kindness then I don't know what is.

Also, L was disgusted by Kira. L must've disliked him a great deal, even if they thought a like in a strange way, L did everything he could... such as lying, and using people so he could catch and kill Kira, now I do not agree with the fact that L had to let people die so he could test his theories, but... If you were in his place, would you want the whole world to go under the rule of a Tyrant? Or let some people die. Sorry, but I prefer the latter.

But L was doing his best to kill Kira.. what more can we ask from him?

Okay, perhaps this was off topic, but it bothered me.

Now, Near, Mello and L.. I don't think they were meant to have ANY kind of disease! It's called HABIT! Lord have mercy people! You have habits too! That's just how they are! It doesn't matter if you think they may have diseases.. Because if they did.. don't you think Ohba would have said so? Sheesh, think about it logically people... think.

Anyway, I am done here.. if you wish to argue with me.. I'm sorry but I won't be coming back to this thread ^^ This is my opinion, you stated yours.. I stated mine. Goodbye ^-^

[Fish and Chips]

Also, Light is screwed up thanks to Ryuk, and holds a very, very, very twisted sense of justice and by the end of the Manga believes himself to be god. Ohba says so himself in the "How to Read Death Note 13" that he really didn't like Light in the least, and said that he needed to go. The only reason he put the ending the way he did was because he didn't want to the Light fans to hate him. Sorry Light fans, he isn't coming back... ask Ohba.

Light Yagami was twisted all along, Ryuk just gave the kid some initiative. It was never about "Justice," it was all to feed his delusions of godhood. A normal person would be satisfied with simply killing criminals and bad guys, or have used it once and never again. From chapter one, Light was sending a dangerous message, not that evil was to be punished, but that someone was punishing evil, and that someone conveniently enough was him. Killing all his victims the same deliberately, including officers and agents whose only crime was opposing him. The minute he killed L, or attempted to kill L, on television, it was not about justice, it was about power. All of it.

Also:

]Okay, perhaps this was off topic, but it bothered me.

Now, Near, Mello and L.. I don't think they were meant to have ANY kind of disease! It's called HABIT! Lord have mercy people! You have habits too! That's just how they are! It doesn't matter if you think they may have diseases.. Because if they did.. don't you think Ohba would have said so? Sheesh, think about it logically people... think.

Anyway, I am done here.. if you wish to argue with me.. I'm sorry but I won't be coming back to this thread ^^ This is my opinion, you stated yours.. I stated mine. Goodbye ^-^

Now this, this was a thick, crisp wad of failure.

Autism/Aspergers isn't a disease, it's a strain of mental condition leaving the patient with habitual behaviors and antisocial tendencies, much like those exhibited by L, Near, and Mellow. It isn't a stretch, and very neatly ties off a lot of their characterization.

Think before you post people.

[minakichan]

As you say, L may not have the same morals, and perhaps they are twisted a bit, but I do not believe he would ever have more people killed ((Than necessary))..

L has no morals. He states it, he flaunts it, and his actions speak for themselves.

L holds more of a sense of Justice, the right kind of justice, than Light.

L ADMITS HE HAS NO SENSE OF JUSTICE EITHER WUT.

But you're not coming back, so I can't point out the textual evidence that proves you wrong ;_;

disease

This makes me sad.

[Nate]

The minute he killed L, or attempted to kill L, on television, it was not about justice, it was about power. All of it.

Right, exactly. Same thing with his accessing the police computer system to try and throw off their leads (though of course it had the opposite effect he wanted it to have), and then killing off the FBI investigators.

Neither L nor Light has the right kind of "justice" if you even want to call it that. Light wanted to become a god; L just wanted to be the best. Remember when he had Light locked up for weeks? He even half-admitted he didn't want to free Light because he didn't want to admit he was wrong. It wasn't about justice, it was about his ego.

L was willing to break laws and kill anyone necessary to do his job. That's not justice any more than blowing up a school building with a gunman holding hostages is justice.

[rocklobster]

That reminds me of the scene from Speed where Keanu Reeves' character is asked if he'd shoot a hostage.