When They Cry/...no Naku Koro ni - Ryukishi07 Appreciation Station

[Bobtheduck]

For whoever else is trying to solve Umineko, someone made a handy collection of all the red text in the game so far. If you don't know what red text is, you don't need to know yet and you'll find out later.

In other news, the anime is coming out next week! Canada Day? More like Umineko Day!

didn't that chart say it's getting released tonight? So we should see it in about 4 or 5 hours from now, in raw form anyhow. Subtitled may take a while.

Don't expect to find any higurashi or umineko stuff on youtube, though, including opening sequences... The anime company is going on copyright hunts ATM... I'm even disguising my review until it blows over, possibly after the anime is done.

[blkmage]

Just finished watching the raw of the first episode. But first!

OP: Shikata Akiko 「片翼の鳥」

I think the animation for the OP and ED really make them. There are some delicious treats in those sequences for those of you who've been following the sound novels.

Now then, episode impressions. This episode is definitely going at lightspeed pacing. Everyone gets a super quick introduction and I'd say at least the first hour of the game got compressed or cut into this first episode. The voices sound pretty good and I guess I was worried for nothing. The music is pretty good so far, but I'll have to wait until a more critical part happens before I can rest assured in that department. Also, the glass breaking + clock eyecatch makes me very, very happy.

[MasterDias]

Saw the first episode.

Liked the OP quite a bit.
Having not gone through the novels, I agree that it felt pretty fast-paced. The first 10 minutes felt like a massive overload of characters. Otherwise, it was interesting.

Also, Maria is sort of annoying...

[Bobtheduck]

Saw the first ep... Just want to know how to say [spoiler]Their faces are missing[/spoiler] in Japanese, for ep 2 or 3. The first ep was 5 issues of the manga, and I heard it was about 4 hours in the visual novel... If it really takes that long for it to get anywhere, I REALLY wouldn't be able to take it... I'll stick to the anime, and use the manga to fill in holes I suppose (like I did with Higurashi)

[blkmage]

The first part isn't quite four hours, it's more like an hour to an hour and a half tops. Each Episode is about 6 to 8 hours, so the first episode went through probably the first quarter of Episode I. This is definitely the slowest part of the visual novels and is basically a gigantic infodump of character background at you for each of the 18 characters. By the time we get the inheritance fight and beach part in the first episode, we have a very solid understanding of where each character is coming from and their motivations.

[Bobtheduck]

Episode 5 of the VN comes soon... I'm wondering if there will be 2 seasons of the anime, just like Higurashi.

Then... What's the next "no naku koro ni"?

"Ookami no naku koro ni"

It'll take place in the middle of a forest...


Maybe

[Fish and Chips]

I think the first episode of Umineko went pretty smoothly. Rapid clip, sure, but better paced than, say, the first thirteen episodes of the new FMA series.

Skimped on a lot of the source material though. If I hadn't been "Playing" the visual novel along side the Anime, I'd have no idea Rosa was supposed to be the most level-headed and sensible of her siblings (comparatively), or that Hideyoshi is actually a pretty nice guy, or Battler's uncomfortable family situation, and a myriad of other details largely brushed over so far.

[blkmage]

It's pretty much guaranteed that there'll be at least two seasons of the anime. Ryukishi07 has stated that there will be seven or eight episodes in total. The boxart for EP5 has been floating around today and it was titled 「うみねこの[color="Red"]な[/color]く頃に散」 and "When They Cry 4", just like Higurashi Kai is considered When They Cry 2. So, it's assumed that the first season will be somewhere around 24-26 episodes and will cover EP1-4, which are essentially the equivalent of the question arcs. Since each game is released at Comiket, the release schedule is something like:

C76 (August 2009): Episode 5
C77 (December 2009): Episode 6
C78 (August 2010): Episode 7
C79 (December 2010): Episode 8?

As for the anime, I'm hoping that they'll be introducing those elements back in over the course of the anime, since some of those details will be very important later on.

EDIT: Oh, and I almost forgot, that in Higurashi-related news, it's been announced that the Higurashi sound novels have been licensed. They'll be releasing the four question arcs as a set in October and then the four answer arcs two months later.

[Bobtheduck]

Why the heck did it have to be picked up by an eroge company?

I can't even look for the news on their site because I don't feel like seeing the other stuff...

I wanna find out about prices... Oh, and Wikipedia is wrong about the rating... Higurashi Daybreak was rated B, but the real Higurashi stuff was rated D (like an M rating) It also says the game is only licensed in Europe... Which I doubt is true because they announced it at AX in Los Angeles...

*sigh* I want to get it, I really do... Not if it's the same price as it is in Japan, though... I mean, no galznerking way.

[blkmage]

It's not hard to see why; there are no other companies that exist that bring visual novels over to North America. I mean, what non-H visual novel localization companies are there? The only one I can think of is Hirameki, who brought over Ever 17, which is still considered one of the best visual novels. What happened to Hirameki? Even with Ever 17, Hirameki died.

Anyway, prices are not great on that site. The cheapest thing is 20 euros and the bigger titles are 40-50 euros. It's not looking good in terms of affordability.

Anyway, Umineko episode 2:
[spoiler]It looks like we've made it to the first twilight. There are visual novel players who are whining about how this episode sped through and didn't capture the nuances of the scenes presented in this episode. My take is that it's kind of hard to do that when we've sacrificed the intricacies of the characters and their relationships from the first episode anyway, so this is fine. Also, great excitement from hearing rahu_goldenslaughterer.[/spoiler]


EDIT: More amazing news, Umineko EP5's OP is out. Again, EP5 marks the beginning of what is probably the answer chapters, so the game gets an extra character (like the Kai in Higurashi Kai), so it's "Umineko Chiru", but we'll probably just stick to referring to EP numbers. It also gets a number bump, so this is the first episode of When They Cry 4. Unfortunately, there is no more Akiko Shikata. The new song is 「オカルティクスの魔女」(Witch of Occultics) by Ayumu(Zwei). A lot of interesting stuff for people who are caught up.

[blkmage]

Umineko episode 3:
[spoiler]I'm pleased that they kept so much of the theorizing and deliberation in this part. With the second twilight cleared at the end of the episode, I'm starting to worry that the pacing will mean that the tea parties get omitted, which would be very bad news for the story.[/spoiler]

[Bobtheduck]

I saw the 4th ep raw. [spoiler]I'm wondering why it took people so long to suspect Maria, considering how creepy she's acted.[/spoiler] Still waiting for it to be subbed, though.

[blkmage]

I saw the 4th ep raw. [spoiler]I'm wondering why it took people so long to suspect Maria, considering how creepy she's acted.[/spoiler] Still waiting for it to be subbed, though.

[spoiler]Probably because she's like nine? Also, other than Beatrice giving her the letter, she's been around other people during the killings.[/spoiler]

It makes me really happy that the game sound effects keep on showing up in the anime.

[Bobtheduck]

I've seen enough horror movies... [spoiler] When a 9 year old starts talking the way Maria was, it's time to start worrying. They did suggest at one point there HAD to be more than one killer... if they're intent on not believing the Beatrice story, I mean.[/spoiler]

[Lady Kenshin]

Just caught up... but I wonder why Maria was watching Higurashi in ep 3? It makes sense for someone like her, but still... she's nine! Creepy kid... have they ever considered it might be what they let her watch on TV? XD

[blkmage]

In case anyone thinks it might be a clue (which, for something like Umineko, is not impossible), it's not. That's because there's a bigger problem than whether Higurashi is appropriate for nine year olds: Umineko takes place in 1986 and Higurashi was produced in 2006.

[Lady Kenshin]

Looks like that was just thrown in for the lulz... or was it? *remembers certain connective theories*

[blkmage]

A word of warning for the Umineko raw watchers this week: if you need subtitles, I highly recommend waiting for them. Things will probably get very, very confusing this week if you don't know what's going on.

[blkmage]

SO, I am sure there will be much to talk about this week.
[spoiler]I was very, very pleased with the tea parties. This is very important. I was even happier to see the inclusion of the secret tea party and Bernkastel.

This is where the story really begins. Welcome to Rokkenjima.[/spoiler]

And some very important information for those of you who only watched the Higurashi anime but don't know anything about the visual novels.
[spoiler]Bernkastel is related to Higurashi. This is not theory; it's fact.

The biggest problem with the Higurashi anime was that Bernkastel was removed from the story. She's a present force in the visual novels and is discussed by Rika. In the visual novels, each chapter begins with a poem by a Frederica Bernkastel. In the Higurashi visual novels, it's made clear that Rika and Bernkastel are part of the same person while not exactly being the same person. It's pretty complicated and not completely figured out yet, but it has to do with the way she's moving in between different shards/worlds.

In short, there is a definite connection here, not just crazy speculation. This becomes even clearer later on in Umineko.

Also, Frederica -> Furude Rika.[/spoiler]

And finally some stuff about the next episode for VN readers.
[spoiler]I hope you're ready for some TOMITAKE FLASH and Tsurupettan.[/spoiler]

[Bobtheduck]

In process of watching ep 5...

At this point... I just gotta wonder... Is Battler just holding the idiot ball, or is his materialist dogma just THAT strong that he's able to accept [spoiler]Kanon and Shanon resurrecting[/spoiler] but not the existence of witches?

[Lady Kenshin]

Episode 5... what in the world is going on? I sure hope things get... uh... clearer eventually.

[Fish and Chips]

In process of watching ep 5...

At this point... I just gotta wonder... Is Battler just holding the idiot ball, or is his materialist dogma just THAT strong that he's able to accept [spoiler]Kanon and Shanon resurrecting[/spoiler] but not the existence of witches?

Battler's stubborness is really quite exceptional in a human. Probably why Beatrice is so interested in him, despite everyone else submitting to her without question.[spoiler]As best I can figure (working off my incomplete knowledge of how magic in Umineko "Works"), Beatrice's fatal flaw is that, no matter how obscure or obtuse, her magic absolutely must fall within the realm of logical possibility. She can do whatever she pleases as many times as she pleases, but there has to be an underlying vein of rationality to make it all possible. Obviously the more people who give up and believe in her, the stronger her magic becomes, and thus she becomes a more complete manifestation]Blkmage, feel totally free to shoot me down if something in a later episode tears this theory to shreds.

[blkmage]

So, if you're confused about the tea party:
[spoiler]The tea parties take place in the meta-world. This is where the real story of Umineko moves. Umineko is about Battler and Beatrice's battle in the meta-world, where Battler tries to deny Beatrice's existence and magic and Beatrice tries to make Battler accept her existence. There'll be a lot more on this later.

The reason everyone was "resurrected" and subsequently fell apart was because Battler doesn't believe in Beatrice or magic. This is also the reason why the epitaph isn't fulfilled. Because Battler doesn't believe, they can't go to the Golden Land.[/spoiler]

Re: Fish's theory
[spoiler]That's pretty much the gist of what Battler has to do. But what isn't so certain is the final outcome. Ryukishi07 has said that the situation in Umineko is a lot worse in Higurashi. If Battler is able to successfully deny the witch, it means that it's likely that one of the 18 are behind the murders. Denying the witch also doesn't necessarily mean that anyone is saved.[/spoiler]

[Yamamaya]

The third season has already been released?!

*goes to watch it* I've watched the first two seasons but I have yet to watch the OVA. It was definitely a great anime. A lot of people dislike the second season but I found the change of tone in Kai refreshing.

[Bobtheduck]

People who disliked Kai were primarily those who were only in it for the gore and not the story. [button="your avatar"]Entirely off topic, but I*d love one of those Okinawan mountain cats. I*m pretty sure they*re illegal, though. Too bad.[/button]

[blkmage]

It's funny because after I played through the four episodes of Umineko, I realized that that and Higurashi Kai were a lot closer to Ryukishi07's writing style than the first season of Higurashi. I suspect that with the music changes and all of the monologues gutted, the first season of Higurashi is very different in tone than the games were with the studio trying to make Higurashi something it's not. Of course, this became very obvious when they had to try and conclude the story in Kai.

[blkmage]

Actually, I remembered what I wanted to do.

Now that Episode I is over, I'd like to solicit your theories about who is doing what. I've found that anime watchers are likely to come to slightly different conclusions about what is going on or from a slightly different angle because of the episode being broken up into weekly chunks rather than going through an entire episode at once. Each week is an explosion of activity for the Umineko anime threads at the forums I visit.

So guys, what do you think? Who did it? How did they do it? Do witches exist? Which side are you on? Are you the worst kind of person? Are you anti-mystery or anti-fantasy?

[Bobtheduck]

If the witches truly don't exist, then... Well, it sort of nullifies all of Higurashi, and not only that, but the entire series is just [spoiler]the last spasms in Battler's brain to try to figure out who killed him. I felt Higurashi had a pretty optimistic ending, so I'd be a bit off-put if this undoes all of that.[/spoiler]

[blkmage]

Welcome to Episode 2. Spot anything that's not quite the same as last time yet?
[spoiler]A pretty solid episode. Nice to see TOMITAKE FLASH. Too bad there was no Tsurupettan, although we still got the Touhou cosplay. Beatrice could have come across as a bit nicer in her encounters with Shannon. And a nice nod to the brass knuckles, for reasons which will become apparent. I was right in assuming they'd introduce relevant details when they become important rather than frontload them all. Case in point: Jessica's asthma.

Noteworthy things: Shannon's and Kanon's interactions with BEATORIIIIIIIIIICHE, Eva doesn't like Shannon and likely knows about George's relationship with her.[/spoiler]

[Yamamaya]

Hmm just watched episode 5

[SPOILER]Nice to see Rika again but what's with her new name and why is she suddenly so OOC? Regardless of that, I'm really enjoying this new series. It reminds me a lot of that Agatha Cristie novel Ten Little Indians. [/SPOILER]

I haven't played the games or read the novels/manga. Well I have one of the Higurashi manga but only the Cotton Drifting Arc that was released in the U.S

So did you guys get a add on translation for the games?