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...of a different kind.

Very recently my church has been going though an issue that we did not ask for nor did anything to deserve. I live in California and go to school in Davis, at the university. I don't know if any of you live in the area I do and so may know about the controversy, but if you do then this explanation may be more applicable to you. I attend the First Baptist Church in Davis. The pastor there is amazing and his current series on Romans is by far the best I've ever heard him. But last week I came to church and at its entrance on the street were a group of picketers carrying signs saying a lot of hateful things toward homosexuals. Now I believe homosexuality is a sin, just as stealing, lying, and pride are, and that they are punished the same: eternal separation from God in Hell. Yet, I do not believe that any one sin should be picked out of thousands and those guilty of it should be abused and treated harshly by the one group of people on the planet (Christians) who should be the most forgiving and the most understanding of their situation (addiction to sin).

What happened at our church is that one of our members is the Yolo County Clerk Recorder who is the one who has to sign the forms telling homosexuals that they can't get married. She made some comments to the Davis newspaper that don't exactly fall in line with the Bible or the beliefs of the church. This radical group called the Church of the Divide saw that in the newspaper and then commenced a harassment campaign against our pastor and the church member commanding our pastor to publicly rebuke the member and kick her out of the church. Our pastor told them no, he talked to the member about the situation and she wanted to resign her church membership. He told her that he did not want her to. In a conversation with one of the members of this radical church our pastor mentioned this. The radical asked him how he could allow sinful people in his congregation! Our pastor answered back that if sinners are not allowed in church then who would be able to attend? The radical didn't like that very much and hung up.

They have now picked out church for two weeks and, frankly, it is getting a little annoying. Not because it bothers me that they are there, it doesn't affect me, but because it has affected our pastor so much. When he became the pastor of this church eleven years ago he vowed that he would never do anything to embarrass the church and now he feels that he may have let us down. I have told him that he has not and that in fact I am proud of him (Christian legalism really pushes my buttons), but he is still taking this pretty hard. Another issue that has arisen from this is that people who just drive by think these picketers are from our church and that our church supports them! This is bad because it damages the view of Christians further in the already liberal city of Davis.

I would like to ask for prayer in this situation as the elders are meeting tomorrow night to talk about this situation. I ask for prayer for wisdom in my church leaders, prayer that the minds of the people of Davis will be guarded and that they will know and be aware that it is not our church doing this and that maybe it will open opportunities to share Christ. Also prayer for the picketers that they will realize what they are doing is wrong, damaging to the body of Christ, and sinful itself.

I realize I've written a lot here, but that is just how complicated this is. I could have written a lot more. I thank you for your prayers.

That is an absolutely ridiculous situation. I'll definitely be praying for you. The words of the radical who didn't want any sinners in church just sicken me. o_o

Whoa that's... yeah a tough situation :/ I'll be praying...

Oh my, that is surely a massive situasion. I do hope I don't mistype or make this message wrong.

Firstly, sin can be forgiven. And I too think homosexuality is a sin, however one of the things I hate more than homosexuality is banners saying stuff like. *God hates homosexuals* It is true that God hates sin, however God loves sinners. I think homosexuals should try to resist temptation just like we should resist temptation from things that can lead us into sinning. However I see the people trying to prevent 'sinners' from entering the church to be in a worse situasion than the homosexuals.

God hates sin, but loves the sinner. Now, as we are sinners then I don't really see how we can put ourselves above others, we who are guilty of sin should help eachother and have Jesus help us. Jesus saves, Jesus can help us sinners change. It may take time and effort, but Jesus can help us get our sins cleansed.

It reminds me of when in the book of James, he speaks of treating some with more respect than others because they are wealthy. To me this seems like the same thing. Homosexuality is a rather blatant sin, whereas things like lying and stealing can be somewhat hidden (in human terms, that is - nothing is hidden from God). So we praise and love those who seem to live a good clean life, and cast down those whose lives are blatantly sinful. How is that fair? Why do prostitutes get sympathy, like, "the poor things, we need to reach them and help them change", but then homosexuals are treated like they are not even worthy to exist? I just don't get it.
All sin is evil no matter how big or small. Sin is sin. Only when we realize this, will we truly be able to reach those people around us. Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying all this stuff is ok. It's sin - of course it's not ok. But we need to realize that without Jesus, we'd be in the same sinful situation ANYONE else who doesn't know Him is. It is only by HIS sacrifice that we can be saved - it is nothing we do.
I will be praying for your church. But know that God is aware of it too, and He won't allow anything that will destroy his true church.

Radical Dreamer wrote:That is an absolutely ridiculous situation. I'll definitely be praying for you. The words of the radical who didn't want any sinners in church just sicken me. o_o

I think if Churches had an exclusive "No sinners, please" policy, attendance would be noticably lacking.

Fish and Chips wrote:I think if Churches had an exclusive "No sinners, please" policy, attendance would be noticably lacking.

Seriously. XD In fact, if anyone showed up at all, they might as well call themselves hypocrites and leave.

We are all sinners, but expulsion is not always improper. The power of expulsion is properly exercised when it is used to push unrepentant sinners toward repentance and aid them in their Christian walk.

That being said, however, I believe the Church of the Divide grossly overstepped its bounds in picketing First Baptist. Not everyone may agree with the pastor's way of handling the situation but it is still his congregation.

I also believe that the pastor acted correctly here. If the expelled member will not be moved to repentance but will instead find a church that affirms his sin, it's not helping him at all. In our pluralistic society reprimanding public sinners while keeping them in fellowship is probably the most effective way of operating.

P.S. Here is the story as posted on the website of the Church of the Divide:

Church of the Divide Pickets Freddie Oakley's Church

P.P.S. If the Church of the Divide should be picketing anyone, it should be that Unitarian church, which refuses to preach the gospel of Jesus Christ and actively leads people to damnation. Gay rights are small potatoes compared to this, no matter what side you take on the issue.

confusing, but God knows. I'll pray o.o/

This is a thread for prayer, not for you to espouse your concept of reality. If you had read the terms of service you agreed to when you signed up, you would know that we do not really want people posting just to stir up debate. Legalistic repetition of something already on the site you linked from does not really help this person. If you wish to pray, please do - but prayer threads are not user-driven advice columns

What part of "This thread is for prayer" is so confusing? Is your self-righteousness so clouding your judgment (pun intended) that you cannot read the posts? When you sign up to a forum for the express purpose of espousing your view one time, then leaving, you show a complete lack of understanding of the real world. Your so-called rebuke will not change anyone's mind, and it costs your time posting, and my time deleting. Don't make me charge you for my time.

Furthermore, you don't seem to have any idea what "My forum, my rules" means. Fine. Both your accounts are hereby banned permanently. I will simply delete any further posts of this nature. Should you decide to harass the forum members repeatedly, we WILL pursue legal action.

In short, "I ask nicely once. I don't like being ignored." If this is unclear, you are beyond all hope of logical thought - which is really ironic, given the message you are attempting to convey.